Criterion's obsession with Suzuki

News on Criterion and Janus Films.
Post Reply
Message
Author
User avatar
Jun-Dai
監督
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:34 am
Location: London, UK
Contact:

#1 Post by Jun-Dai » Mon May 02, 2005 2:49 pm

1. It is surprising that Criterion has six Suzuki films and not a single Mizoguchi or Naruse (not to even mention great non-Japanese directors). I suspect this is entirely due to politics. The Suzuki's might be something of a now or never opportunity, or perhaps it is a matter of getting cooperation from the director while he's still alive, or perhaps they are simply available for release (and Criterion clearly doesn't mind putting these out in near-barebones editions) while the Mizoguchis and Naruses are not (they probably need significant restoration, and Criterion, as far as I know, doesn't do restorations -- they only do digital cleanups). In any case, Criterion appears to be working on both Mizoguchi and Naruse, and I suspect they are putting significant effort into both. After all, if they can get Richie or someone of his reputation to do a commentary, they would surely be willing to delay the release to accomodate their busy schedules?

2. It is also suprising that Criterion could simultaneously consider Suzuki great enough to release six of his films (rather than pushing them through HVE) and not great enough to warrant more features, particularly at a time when their barebones discs are getting fewer (probably due to the popularity of special features in general, as well as Criterion's enhanced reknown and popularity, which would make getting contributors easier).

User avatar
oldsheperd
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2004 5:18 pm
Location: Rio Rancho/Albuquerque

#2 Post by oldsheperd » Mon May 02, 2005 3:22 pm

HVE has released several Suzuki titles.

User avatar
Jun-Dai
監督
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:34 am
Location: London, UK
Contact:

#3 Post by Jun-Dai » Mon May 02, 2005 3:37 pm

True, but Criterion has all of the "you like Suzuki? This is the Suzuki you have to see" films, excepting perhaps Zigeunerweisen, which no one has released. Note: I'm basing this all on hearsay, since the only Suzuki films I've seen are the ones Criterion has put out + Pistol Opera.

User avatar
oldsheperd
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2004 5:18 pm
Location: Rio Rancho/Albuquerque

#4 Post by oldsheperd » Mon May 02, 2005 3:46 pm

You're exactly right. Having seen some of the HVE Suzukis, the Criterion chosen ones are much better. Maybe with the exception of Tattoed Life, the rest are pretty standard fare.

User avatar
Hrossa
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 7:11 pm
Location: Prince Edward Island
Contact:

#5 Post by Hrossa » Mon May 02, 2005 5:03 pm

Let's hope that the Suzuki well hasn't gone dry. I'd love to see Zigeunerweisen come from Criterion or HVE as well as some of the films that have been released elsewhere on DVD, like Detective Bureau 2-3 or Carmen from Kawachi.

User avatar
Jun-Dai
監督
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:34 am
Location: London, UK
Contact:

#6 Post by Jun-Dai » Mon May 02, 2005 5:47 pm

The other thing to consider are the whims of the producers at Criterion. Every title might require the unanimous approval of Criterion's staff (Becker hinted at this in one of his interviews), but it seems like a fair amount of Criterion's output is driven by individual producer's tastes, and this may be especially true with regard to deciding between taking a title and passing it on to HVE. I'm guessing that the titles were being pushed from outside, and one of the producers with a soft spot for Suzuki decided that it would be better to grab them than give them to HVE and miss forever the chance to work on them. Or something like that.

User avatar
Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

#7 Post by Gregory » Mon May 02, 2005 5:54 pm

Jun-Dai wrote:perhaps they are simply available for release ... while the Mizoguchis and Naruses are not
Criterion released some Mizuguchi films during the later half of their laserdisc years. Would the film elements really have deteriorated that much since then, or have the company's standards increased that much?
In any case, Criterion appears to be working on both Mizoguchi and Naruse
What makes you say they appear to be working on Naruse? (I'm just curious.)

User avatar
Jun-Dai
監督
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:34 am
Location: London, UK
Contact:

#8 Post by Jun-Dai » Mon May 02, 2005 6:25 pm

Criterion released some Mizuguchi films during the later half of their laserdisc years. Would the film elements really have deteriorated that much since then, or have the company's standards increased that much?
I'd think the latter. Also, considering the reaction when they put out Diary of a Country Priest, I doubt they'd feel comfortable slipping Osaka Elegy or something out as a barebones release. Then again, I could be wrong. More importantly, I think Criterion would avoid working on such films if there is a hint of restoration in the future, and it's possible that someone out there has a plan for it that Criterion is privy to.
What makes you say they appear to be working on Naruse? (I'm just curious.)
A little birdie told me.

User avatar
bunuelian
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:49 am
Location: San Diego

#9 Post by bunuelian » Mon May 02, 2005 6:35 pm

What does a release's lack of extras have to do with Criterion's attitude about the director? Is Bunuel some second-rate hack because his releases are all nearly bare-bones? Is Andrei Rublev a second-rate film?

I'm also not convinced that releasing one film ahead of another shows any sort of preference for the first film, or its director. It may be as simple as the clock running on their rights, and they want to get them out as soon as possible.

User avatar
Cinephrenic
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:58 pm
Location: Paris, Texas

#10 Post by Cinephrenic » Mon May 02, 2005 6:55 pm

Well they should focus on releasing more new wave Japanese films from other people like Imamura, Oshima, and some Ichikawa. They totally lack right now in those areas. They seem to hold a bunch of their films. What the hell happened to Woman in the Dunes? I'm still glad they released all the Suzuki in hand.
Last edited by Cinephrenic on Mon May 02, 2005 9:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
The Fanciful Norwegian
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:24 pm
Location: Teegeeack

#11 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Mon May 02, 2005 7:10 pm

Well they always focus on releasing more new wave Japanese films from other people like Imamura, Oshima, and some Ichikawa. They totally lack right now in those areas. They seem to hold a bunch of their films.
Ichikawa and Imamura, maybe, but I haven't seen anything indicating that Criterion is holding on to any Oshima. Correct me if I'm wrong.

User avatar
the dancing kid
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 7:35 pm

#12 Post by the dancing kid » Mon May 02, 2005 7:42 pm

Why does Criterion releasing Suzuki's films have to be "instead of" Mizoguchi or other directors? I don't think any other filmmaker in the collection gets that kind of reception. I don't really know how Criterion works in terms of developing different releases (is there a team just for Japanese films?), but I don't see how releasing one thing means they are neglecting another.

Is Suzuki still considered a less significant filmmaker to most people? I realize he's only been known outside of Japan for a little over a decade, but he seems to be an incredibly popular cult figure right now and his career has even been rekindled lately. He has a new film playing at Cannes this year, so maybe they bumped up the "flesh" films to capitalize on the attention he'll be getting from the festival. In any event, he's a pretty important figure in Japanese film history, although perhaps his career as a popular genre filmmaker instead of an international figure like Kurosawa makes his work less accessible to non-Japanese audiences.

As for the lack of special features, there hasn't been a tremendous amount of scholarship done on Suzuki, and there isn't a "Suzuki authority" that Criterion can turn to for commentaries or other materials. David Desser and Sato Tadao both have a bit to say about him, but he isn't the focus of either's work. I think the other Suzuki's have been pretty strong sellers as well, so maybe Criterion uses them to subsidize more ambitious releases.

User avatar
Cinephrenic
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:58 pm
Location: Paris, Texas

#13 Post by Cinephrenic » Mon May 02, 2005 9:31 pm

No, but you just corrected me in my bad writing. I meant the opposite.

User avatar
Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

#14 Post by Gregory » Mon May 02, 2005 11:30 pm

I'd love to have lots of Suzuki releases and lots of Mizoguchi (and lots of other stuff I won't get into). Unless Criterion increases their output quite a bit more, I'm not sure what the answer is. Perhaps kicking better quality titles down to HVE, so they won't have to spend so much of their time on things like "Codename: Icarus" while so much languishes. Also, HVE's standards aren't as sky-high as Criterion's so old films looking old wouldn't be as much of an issue. There are many films I'd like to see released in the next few years, looking their best, regardless of whether a restoration happens to be in the cards.

unclehulot
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:09 pm
Location: here and there

#15 Post by unclehulot » Mon May 02, 2005 11:48 pm

I suppose it's a matter of changing taste and how the marketplace absorbs the "high classical" styled directors. It's easy to ride the wave of a fad when a director hasn't been 1) exposed much in the west 2)fits in a certain genre which has it's own built in audience. I'm not saying Suzuki should NOT be issued, but I think 20 years ago he wouldn't have been given the time of day critically OR in the marketplace.

I think Criterion finds they are able to shovel more Suzuki down the pike NOW, for whatever reason. I'm happy to RENT them, but I would BUY the Naruse or Mizoguchi.

I do hope the delay is to find better elements, because the 30's Mizoguchi issued on LD were truly dire looking, and what New Yorker issued on VHS of him was simply some of the worst looking stuff in the history of home video.

User avatar
dx23
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 8:52 pm
Location: Puerto Rico

#16 Post by dx23 » Tue May 03, 2005 1:08 am

True, but Criterion has all of the "you like Suzuki? This is the Suzuki you have to see" films,
Isn't it supposed to be this way? The major works of the director go to Criterion, while the lesser works go to HVE.

BrightEyes23
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 2004 9:46 am

#17 Post by BrightEyes23 » Tue May 03, 2005 1:54 am

It could just be that they had the chance to prepare the suzuki's first and the rest are in the pipeline due to restorations, special features, maybe trying to obtain features that are taking longer. The Suzuki's, as pointed out, aren't really special feature filled, but the latest transfers have been pretty good, so maybe they didn't see the opportunity to add anything to the discs and felt like putting them out since they were as "full" as they'd get. Also, we've yet to get a big boxed set this year except for the Three War Films (or was Fanny & Alexander this year too? I thought it was last year), so i don't think its unforseeable to get a boxed set of one of these other Japanese greats in perhaps October or November. They might just surprise us and release a box of all the mizoguchi's that were being screened at the University of Michigan with restored prints, in a boxed set on an even grander scale than the Cassavettes which was what, 9 discs? They seem to like to outdo themselves every year for the Christmas season too...

User avatar
Lino
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:18 am
Location: Sitting End
Contact:

#18 Post by Lino » Tue May 03, 2005 3:46 am

Personally, I think it all comes down to print/good transfer availability. Or even distribution rights being available to companies.

These Suzukis that are being released this year have all or practically all been already released in France either last year or next June. And I'm pretty sure that whatever title is being released by the bfi and which is Criterion worthy will be given a spine number sooner or later.

This is easy to understand if you have in mind the fact that whenever a Janus title makes the art-house rounds it will end up having either a HVe or Criterion DVD release.

As for the Mizoguchi titles - although they have been released both in France, Spain and the UK, let's not forget that they are yet to come out on DVD in Japan. And if you look at the Beaver's reviews for those titles, it's quite clear that they have not been restored.

Criterion always strives for the best materials and maybe that's why we still haven't seen a single Mizoguchi title with a spine number.

Just my two cents.

unclehulot
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:09 pm
Location: here and there

#19 Post by unclehulot » Tue May 03, 2005 10:53 am

Annie Mall wrote:

As for the Mizoguchi titles - although they have been released both in France, Spain and the UK, let's not forget that they are yet to come out on DVD in Japan. And if you look at the Beaver's reviews for those titles, it's quite clear that they have not been restored.

Criterion always strives for the best materials and maybe that's why we still haven't seen a single Mizoguchi title with a spine number.

Just my two cents.
SOME of those Mizoguchi's may only exist in rough condition.....there are limited options on a number of the 30s and 40s films. The question as to what "restored" consists of then, is how to maximize what you've got with video restoration tools. I'm not sure I would call this restoration.....I reserve that for working from the closest film sources to the original and as many secondary (i.e. positive print) sources as possible, and that's where I think we have a problem with these films. It's probably the same situation with the earlier films in the Ozu canon. So, they won't look like the "typical" Criterion product. I hope this doesn't stop them, but I'm sure they will cringe when the reviews pour in criticizing the lack of restoration and the "transfer" problems! So, I do hope those spine numbers appear when they have done the most exhaustive search for the best materials, but not AFTER hell freezes over, because I'd love to hold the buggers in my grubby hands before then, please!

User avatar
Andre Jurieu
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 3:38 pm
Location: Back in Milan (Ind.)

#20 Post by Andre Jurieu » Tue May 03, 2005 12:16 pm

unclehulot wrote:but not AFTER hell freezes over
But if hell freezes over, I can plan ahead and bring my skates with me, along with my Mizoguchi and Ozu DVDs. I'm just saying.

User avatar
Jun-Dai
監督
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 4:34 am
Location: London, UK
Contact:

#21 Post by Jun-Dai » Tue May 03, 2005 12:20 pm

Keep in mind that Criterion cannot always work with the best sources possible if they have not undergone restoration and preservation efforts--and even when they can, they may not want to. There may have been a time when the best print or a negative might have been lent out for Criterion to make a laserdisc, but as the very process of getting a digital master from a negative or print is damaging to the material, I suspect many negative/best print holders would be unwilling to work with Criterion unless another company is willing to do a restoration along with. This was the case for Playtime (which is why the original edition was based on 35mm), and it may well be the case for any number of other films. I suspect that for such films as Pandora's Box, Criterion is just sitting around waiting for someone to do a restoration/preservation. For other films that have been restored periodically, like M or Seven Samurai, they probably just work with existing, less-than-ideal prints from the most recent restoration/preservation effort, and are then forced to reissue the film once a serious restoration is done. I'm sure they'd prefer to keep reissues to a minimum, since it means doing the same work twice, yet it would be a shame not to do a reissue when a major restoration effort has taken place.

Even if the best sources are not in very good condition, it behooves Criterion not to make them any worse, and the only way to do that is to make some attempt to preserve the materials, which is beyond the scope of Criterion.

User avatar
Lino
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 6:18 am
Location: Sitting End
Contact:

#22 Post by Lino » Tue May 03, 2005 1:27 pm

Quote from the Random Speculation thread:
Dear Simon,

We look forward to releasing some Mizoguchi in the coming year.

Best,
JM


On 5/1/05 12:58 PM, "Simon Catz" <rietendak@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Sender: Simon Catz
> Email: -
> Question Type: Question
> Comment: Dear John,
>
> back in 2003 you indicated that Criterion was working on some Mizoguchi,
> which would hopefully come out in 2003/4. Has the production on these
> titles been halted or is there still some Mizoguchi coming? Is Ugetsu
> Monogatari one of them?
>
> Thanks in advance,
> Simon Catz, Amsterdam
If I'm not mistaken, wasn't Peter Becker who on a previous occasion already stated that they would release a Mizoguchi title (Life of O'Haru?) even if he thought that it wasn't going to be one of their highest selling titles?

User avatar
Cinephrenic
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:58 pm
Location: Paris, Texas

#23 Post by Cinephrenic » Tue May 03, 2005 3:01 pm

Someone in Criterion is not a Mizoguchi fan, and they are taking it out on us. I think as the year is getting tighter (with 4 months of unannounced titles remain), I bet we will see a bunch of films get pushed into 2006. We know a majority of these, but I bet we'll see Seven Samurai and the Tatis in December.

User avatar
Gregory
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 4:07 pm

#24 Post by Gregory » Tue May 03, 2005 3:32 pm

Annie Mall:
It was Ugetsu Monogatari. The Mizoguchi laserdiscs must have sold extremely poorly for them to be that worried about sales but of course DVD is a much different market.

User avatar
Cinephrenic
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:58 pm
Location: Paris, Texas

#25 Post by Cinephrenic » Tue May 03, 2005 7:14 pm

And much cheaper.

I think one of the reasons we see a whole lot of Suzukis, is that Criterion has been croping a lot of Nikkatsu's catalog, if not finishing it. Last and this year we saw many Nikkatsu catalog releases such as: The Pornographers, Fighting Elegy, Youth of the Beast, Story of a Prostitute, Gate of Flesh, Crazed Fruit, Underworld Beauty, Life of a Tattooed Man, Kanto Wanderer, Charisma, and Bloody Territories.

I think we might see these next if they continue along the same lines either as Criterion or HVe: Intentions of Murder, The Burmese Harp, The Insect Woman, Pigs and Battleships, Deep Desire of Gods, and Velvet Hustler. Not much else worth releasing from Nikkatsu, anyone know some films worth releasing from them?

Post Reply