Unauthorized Releases & Bootlegs

Discuss North American DVDs and Blu-rays or other DVD and Blu-ray-related topics.
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sidehacker
Joined: Sat Mar 17, 2007 2:49 am
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#251 Post by sidehacker » Thu Jul 31, 2008 2:56 pm

There's a custom DVD of the same Japanese TV broadcast with custom English subs from the rather-beat up VHS (?) copy.

Perkins Cobb
Joined: Tue Apr 29, 2008 12:49 pm

#252 Post by Perkins Cobb » Fri Aug 01, 2008 12:53 pm

This business of downloadable fan-subtitles really seems to be the future of hard-to-find movies passed around among collectors. Very often now when I Google some rare movie that's passing through NYC to see if there are copies of it out there, I get a hit on some Bit Torrent subtitles file. So I'm increasingly concerned by my complete lack of understanding on how to make this work. I've come across a few FAQs on the net that explain it, but they're all filled with lots of technobabble that's meaningless to me.

I'd be more than happy to join the Asian DVD Club and make any contribution that a non-Asian language speaker could, but they seem like a rather technologically exclusionary group.

SalParadise
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:39 pm
Location: Hangzhou

blu-ray bootlegs

#253 Post by SalParadise » Sat Aug 02, 2008 12:03 pm

Just thought I'd let you all know.

I live in China and I was surprised to see today copies of recently released Blu-ray titles at my local 'dvd (discount) store'. Regular DVDs normally go for €1.5 a pop. These blu-rays were going for €3.0 a pop! So I guess it's not that hard or expensive to produce these discs! I'm curious to see how many, if any, Chinese people will go out and buy a blu-player to view these discs. Half of the people still buy and watch VCD! You really got to hand it to the pirates in Guangdong. They have no need to produce them, they are not going to make a fortune out of them, but they simply have the beautiful desire to provide the Chinese consumer with cheap ultra-high quality movies, good on 'em!

I for sure am not going to fork out x amount of dollars for a blu-ray player! (well, perhaps if I had a freakin' awesome display I might...but just have a regular CRT.)

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Glynford
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 10:13 pm
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Hideko

#254 Post by Glynford » Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:47 pm

I thought I read somewhere that all pre 1952 Japanese films were Public Domain. If that is the case the only thing subject to possible copyright would be the fan subs!

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Michael Kerpan
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Re: Hideko

#255 Post by Michael Kerpan » Sat Aug 02, 2008 9:31 pm

Glynford wrote:I thought I read somewhere that all pre 1952 Japanese films were Public Domain. If that is the case the only thing subject to possible copyright would be the fan subs!
If one is releasing a DVD based on a public domain _source_ - - this would be true. But if a studio has done extensive restoration work on a film, the restoration itself might be copyrightable -- even if the underlying film is not. So simply copying a DVD of a copyrighted "restored version" might well violate copyright law.

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The Fanciful Norwegian
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:24 pm
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Re: blu-ray bootlegs

#256 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:58 pm

SalParadise wrote:I live in China and I was surprised to see today copies of recently released Blu-ray titles at my local 'dvd (discount) store'. !
You sure these were actual BDs? The pirates around here have begun selling DVD-9s in Blu-ray (and even HD DVD!) packaging.

SalParadise
Joined: Sun Apr 09, 2006 2:39 pm
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Re: blu-ray bootlegs

#257 Post by SalParadise » Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:03 am

The Fanciful Norwegian wrote:
SalParadise wrote:I live in China and I was surprised to see today copies of recently released Blu-ray titles at my local 'dvd (discount) store'.
You sure these were actual BDs? The pirates around here have begun selling DVD-9s in Blu-ray (and even HD DVD!) packaging.
Yes, they have been doing that here. But these were being sold in proper cases and when I spoke to the shop owner (who I trust) he said they were the real thing. One way is to simply check, but I don't think he would lie and sell them to me only for me to prove: "Hey, they work on regular DVD player! So they can't be real"

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Hopscotch
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2008 8:30 pm

#258 Post by Hopscotch » Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:03 am

Does anybody here have a copy of Bob Dylan's 1978 film Renaldo & Clara? I've been wanting to see this desperately, and it seems bootlegs are the only way to go. I've seen some pricey ones around, but I'd much rather...you know... send somebody a dvd and have them just burn it for me or something. I know it's on youtube, but I'm looking to see the whole thing, uncut, on my T.V. Many thanks to anyone who responds.

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Cold Bishop
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 9:45 pm
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#259 Post by Cold Bishop » Mon Aug 04, 2008 1:10 am

'Tis what the internets are for (and I'm not talking about Youtube). I found a three part mpeg within seconds of reading your post. Making a dvd of it shouldn't be too hard if you have a burner.

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impossiblefunky
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Bad Year For Bootleggers

#260 Post by impossiblefunky » Sun Aug 17, 2008 11:10 pm

A good year of rare releases means a bad year for bootleggers apparently.

RevengeIsMyDestiny.com (Shocking Videos) closed down and now superhappyfun.com is closing too (Aug 31 per the website). I also heard a rumor that pimpadelicwonderland.com is no more (or soon will be).

Does this mean that grey markets are a thing of the past or that they'll be scattered to the four winds and have smaller niche markets of gore, horror, Asian titles?

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Lemmy Caution
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:26 am
Location: East of Shanghai

#261 Post by Lemmy Caution » Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:14 pm

Otherwise, about a half-dozen Blue Ray titles began turning up in China a few weeks ago. The price, around $5 per, is quite expensive by Chinese pirated Dvd standards, but is sure to come down as they proliferate.

Is there supposed to be some sort of anti-pirating technology on BR's?
JacquesQ wrote:But do we have to suppose that all DVDs published in China or with Chinese subtitles are bootlegs? Isn't there one single Chinese publisher selling legitimate DVDs in China, that one could then also find on sale to Western customers by Chinese e-merchants?

I know nothing about that particular title, but let's say Studio X (in the West) sells the publishing rights for China to Y Corporation; the difference in income being what it is, one may well suppose that Y Corporation will sell the DVDs in continental China for far less than Western prices (let us not forget that the actual cost of physically making a DVD is around 10 cents, so there is still room for profit by selling for less than our usual $20) ; and may we not further suppose that some clever Chinese internauts get hold of a bunch of DVDs at internal Chinese price (say $5?) and sell them with a profit at $10?

Though it is obvious that many Chinese copies are bootlegs, it does not prove tha they all are. Admittedly making a line of conduct for oneself based on that is a difficult task, other than "I will not buy one Chinese DVD because so many are bootlegs" or "from now on I will buy all my DVDs in China because they are so mich cheaper". But wouldn't it for instance be feasible to obtain catalogues of "legal" Chinese publishers and see what's in them and at what cost? Or to ask a couple of major Western distributors who they sell their rights to for China, and where one may enquire about it (though they will certainly be reluctant, knowing that it would definitely allow anyone to buy DVDs "made in China" at 1/4 the price and with a clear conscience)?
I've lived in China since the advent of DVDs. Almost all of the DVDs produced and/or sold in China are indeed bootlegs. Many are high quality bootlegs, where the artwork on the cover and disc are very well done. More recent films tend to have worse quality and poor English on the covers (and Chinglish subs or perhaps subs from the wrong film).

I'm pretty sure that I've read that over 95% of the DVDs sold in China are pirated. The only sources for legitimate DVDs are the gov't bookstores and a few cultural outlets (like the store in the Shanghai Grand Theater). Even in such stores they mostly sell dubious Bo Ying releases primarily of old films supposedly with lapsed copyrights. Bo Ying is shady, and crappy enough to routinely end a film before the credits begin to roll.

Due to the thriving pirate market, even the legit releases in China are sold for $5 or less per disc. So your idea of making a profit on legit releases is very difficult pricewise, and limited to gov't distributors.

Western studios do not normally enter the Chinese market because there is little money to be made and the pirated DVDs control the market. One or two labels have tried to sell legit DVDs in China for under $3. Don't think that's been too successful, as that's usually double the pirate rate. Not sure whether such efforts/experiments are still ongoing.

In short, you have to make an effort to find and buy legit DVDs in China, and they are priced at 2x or 3x the pirate price.

With cheap broadband easily available in China (US $15 - $20 per month), most young Chinese I know consider even pirated DVDs too expensive, and have switched over to downloading films.

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carax09
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:22 am
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#262 Post by carax09 » Mon Aug 18, 2008 12:31 pm

Lemmy Caution wrote:With cheap broadband easily available in China (US $15 - $20 per month), most young Chinese I know consider even pirated DVDs too expensive, and have switched over to downloading films.
I caught part of a program on NPR that was discussing this very phenomenon. Do you think the loss of these potential consumers will cause the bootleg shops to be forced out of business? Perhaps this situation is forcing the shop owners to switch to blu to stay viable...

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myrnaloyisdope
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#263 Post by myrnaloyisdope » Mon Aug 25, 2008 5:33 pm

Anyone know where I could find a copy of Mark Donskoi's "My Apprenticeship"?. I don't really want to spend a 50-100 dollars for the VHS tape.

wpqx
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:01 am

#264 Post by wpqx » Mon Aug 25, 2008 9:23 pm

I rented it from Facets and the quality was fairly poor (as most twenty year old VHS tapes will be), if you can find somewhere to rent it (Facets does online rentals if that's an option) you can always make your own copy, it certainly isn't encrypted.

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myrnaloyisdope
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#265 Post by myrnaloyisdope » Mon Aug 25, 2008 10:36 pm

Cool, I just joined and found a couple other films I was looking for.

Thanks.

Edit: Just received an email that Facets doesn't send rentals to Canada.

So the question is still does anyone know where I can find an inexpensive copy of Donskoi's My Apprenticeship??

wpqx
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:01 am

#266 Post by wpqx » Tue Aug 26, 2008 7:21 pm

That's a tough break I used to live four blocks from Facets which needless to say was beneficial

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feihong
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:20 pm

Out 1

#267 Post by feihong » Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:30 am

Has anybody on the thread had any luck finding an English-subtitled version of Out 1 or Out 1:Spectre?

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Cold Bishop
Joined: Tue May 30, 2006 9:45 pm
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Re: Out 1

#268 Post by Cold Bishop » Wed Aug 27, 2008 1:56 am

None exist... I'm surprised no one has attempted to translate the Italian subs, although. I've considered trying to slog through the incomprehensible French-Italian episodes myself, and use my minor understanding of french and italian to do it, but I don't have that sort of commitment.

KG, Cinema-Obscura, and Co. should band together and really attempt an open-source sub project, but alas.

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myrnaloyisdope
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#269 Post by myrnaloyisdope » Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:19 am

Has anybody on the thread had any luck finding an English-subtitled version of Out 1 or Out 1:Spectre?
I know of someone who has a copy of Out 1:Spectre, apparently it is very poor quality, but it is subbed. PM for details.
Last edited by myrnaloyisdope on Wed Aug 27, 2008 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.

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The Fanciful Norwegian
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:24 pm
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Re: Out 1

#270 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Wed Aug 27, 2008 11:18 am

Cold Bishop wrote:None exist... I'm surprised no one has attempted to translate the Italian subs, although.
Some people at a certain file-sharing site are trying to whip up some subs using a previously-published English translation, but they were having a hard time syncing it to the Italian subs (and the translation they're working with leaves out too much), so they seem to have hit a brick wall.

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Cold Bishop
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Re: Out 1

#271 Post by Cold Bishop » Wed Aug 27, 2008 4:56 pm

myrnaloyisdope wrote:I know of someone who has a copy of Out 1:Spectre, apparently it is very poor quality, but it is subbed. PM for details.
Inter-est-ing. I was unaware of Spectre bootlegs, period, let alone subbed. Do you know what sort of source it looks it came from? (and do pm me if it isn't info they want out)
The Fanciful Norwegian wrote:Some people at a certain file-sharing site are trying to whip up some subs using a previously-published English translation, but they were having a hard time syncing it to the Italian subs (and the translation they're working with leaves out too much), so they seem to have hit a brick wall.
Are they using .srt? If so, and if there not dead set on keeping it within only their file-sharing site, I'd recommend setting up an AtWiki open-source page per each episode and copying-and-pasting the information they have. I can't say I could help right off hand, but certainly it would leave it open to me, and if they passed the info around, any other interested party to help in creating and editing the subs. I'm sure there's a lot of people who would love to see subs, and some of them certainly must know enough italian and french to complete it.

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david hare
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#272 Post by david hare » Wed Aug 27, 2008 5:28 pm

Someone who shall remain nameless has asked me if anyone anywhere has managed to do English subs for three early Ophuls, Die Verkaufte Braut, Verliebte Firma and and Lachende Erben. I can't find anything at the usual place but this doesn't mean they are not out there. Certainly a print of Verkaufte can be made available if subs are possible.

wpqx
Joined: Sun Jun 15, 2008 5:01 am

#273 Post by wpqx » Wed Aug 27, 2008 8:52 pm

When I saw Out 1 there was someone who was doing subtitles live while following a script, it was strange and worked like a slide show posted over the film. Same happened when I saw some rare Czech films at Facets a year or two back.

quequetz
Joined: Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:25 pm

#274 Post by quequetz » Fri Aug 29, 2008 10:52 am

myrnaloyisdope wrote:Anyone know where I could find a copy of Mark Donskoi's "My Apprenticeship"?. I don't really want to spend a 50-100 dollars for the VHS tape.
Try here, but, most likely without English subtitles.

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Antoine Doinel
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#275 Post by Antoine Doinel » Fri Aug 29, 2008 10:55 am

wpqx wrote:When I saw Out 1 there was someone who was doing subtitles live while following a script, it was strange and worked like a slide show posted over the film. Same happened when I saw some rare Czech films at Facets a year or two back.
Yeah, I saw some Nikkatsu films this summer where they did the same thing.

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