The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

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mfunk9786
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#351 Post by mfunk9786 » Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:10 pm

Yeah, this whole thing started with De Niro developing the project with Scorsese, not sure why we're spinning yarns about things that have already been documented

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therewillbeblus
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#352 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:00 pm

I'm not saying De Niro wasn't involved at the beginning but given Netflix's eagerness to finance and distribute auteurist films as of late, I don't think it's hard to believe that they would have financed Scorsese's next film regardless of that star's participation, but I clearly read the response incorrectly as insinuating rather than literally. Either way, that didn't address my main point about Scorsese finding an interesting way to use De Niro's current relaxed expressiveness to the film's benefit, which was the real intention of the post rather than the mechanics of how the project started.

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diamonds
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#353 Post by diamonds » Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:39 pm

Except, your original post is still flawed because of its fundamental misattribution. De Niro came to Scorsese with the project, his emotional attachment to the material was the impetus for the film and undoubtedly sculpted the performance; it's not some ingenious casting coup on Scorsese's part. In pursuit of a more traditional auteurist reading you're marginalizing De Niro's contributions to the work. (Didn't Rosenbaum identify De Niro as one of the four auteurs of Taxi Driver? I see no reason why that line of thinking couldn't apply to this film).

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mfunk9786
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#354 Post by mfunk9786 » Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:41 pm

Right, it was his reaction to the book (one of getting emotional over how sad it was) and their initial discussions about what this film would look like that drove the direction that Scorsese wanted to take the film. I don't think Scorsese, or De Niro, consider their careers as cynically as outsiders looking in do. A 76-year-old Scorsese has better things to do than to construct meta-narratives about how his friend De Niro was panned for his performance in Bad Grandpa

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therewillbeblus
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#355 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:58 pm

diamonds wrote:
Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:39 pm
Except, your original post is still flawed because of its fundamental misattribution. De Niro came to Scorsese with the project, his emotional attachment to the material was the impetus for the film and undoubtedly sculpted the performance; it's not some ingenious casting coup on Scorsese's part. In pursuit of a more traditional auteurist reading you're marginalizing De Niro's contributions to the work. (Didn't Rosenbaum identify De Niro as one of the four auteurs of Taxi Driver? I see no reason why that line of thinking couldn't apply to this film).
You're right, I'm sure it was a collaborative process as is all their work. I didn't mean to imply a skewed relationship with Scorsese as this puppeteer to De Niro's void of agency, and tried to ensure that I didn't convey a message of manipulation by comparing this as an inverse, but wanted to throw out the idea that De Niro's general demeanor he's grown into over the years that feels like a comfortable kind of passive confidence (not a dig) was utilized (in general, not by Scorsese alone) to a unique effect here. Alternate perspectives are able to bring out certain sides of an actor they cannot access alone, just as an actor is able to bring skills and thoughts to the table that a director may have not otherwise considered, and is it really that far-fetched to assume that Scorsese may have directed De Niro in a certain direction, as the film's director and someone who has known the man and worked with him for decades? I don't see how that is mutually exclusive from the idea that the process was collaborative, which of course it was. My semantics were off, sure, but the idea is the same.

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Cold Bishop
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#356 Post by Cold Bishop » Thu Dec 05, 2019 9:32 pm

Apropos of the current discussion: let’s not forget that Raging Bull was De Niro’s passion project, and Scorsese had to be convinced to do it. It always sounded, from the years of lead up, this was mot dissimilar.

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flyonthewall2983
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#357 Post by flyonthewall2983 » Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:07 pm

As for the other way around, I believe that Warner Brothers would only make Goodfellas is if De Niro was cast.

Jack Kubrick
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#358 Post by Jack Kubrick » Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:28 pm

flyonthewall2983 wrote:
Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:07 pm
As for the other way around, I believe that Warner Brothers would only make Goodfellas is if De Niro was cast.
John Malkovich was one of the casting choices for the Jimmy role before Warner wanted a more bankable star in De Niro. Scorsese has tended to have trouble even attracting financial backing without the presence of his major leading men, Bob and Leo.

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Finch
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#359 Post by Finch » Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:31 pm

Early viewing figures on Netflix are promising even when accounting for people who didn't watch it all the way through. Netflix surely has data on how many people simply stopped for a break and resumed at a later date.

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Finch
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Re: The Irishman (Martin Scorsese, 2019)

#360 Post by Finch » Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:36 pm


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