308 Masculin féminin

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AZAI
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:17 am

#51 Post by AZAI » Sat Jul 09, 2005 3:48 am

interesting, completely forgot about the interview in the film.....Funny that I am not the only one wondering about it :)!

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Abulafia
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#52 Post by Abulafia » Sun Jul 10, 2005 8:05 am

I also remember reading somewhere that Masculine-Feminine was the first B&W film of Godard's to be 1.66 rather than the 1.33 of all of his previous B&W films.

solent

#53 Post by solent » Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:42 pm

The R2 is not 1.33:1 so a Beaver comparison would be welcome. I will get the CC version regardless and when I do I'll compare it with the BFI video which seems to be the same ratio as the Optimum R2 release.

By the way can anyone confirm whether the US version VHS of MASCULIN is full frame?

kieslowski
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#54 Post by kieslowski » Mon Jul 11, 2005 5:25 am

The UK R2 DVD is 1:33 (or 1:37). Screen caps here: http://www.dvdtimes.co.uk/content.php?contentid=56702

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The Fanciful Norwegian
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#55 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Mon Jul 11, 2005 8:55 am

The French DVD is full-frame as well. There's a Japanese DVD but I don't know about its AR. The VHS was full-frame but it was a New Yorker release and I'm not sure how good they were with OAR on VHS. Another note regarding the theatrical release: IIRC the subtitles were placed for Academy ratio and the image couldn't have been matted to 1.66:1 without cutting some of the subtitles off along the bottom. This doesn't prove the OAR, but it does mean that Rialto themselves determined that the film should be shown in Academy ratio and it wasn't just the projectionist's decision.

KJB2
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#56 Post by KJB2 » Tue Jul 12, 2005 11:26 am

Hmmm. I saw this last night at the local revival house (the new Rialto print), and it definitely seemed to be at least 1:66 - significantly wider than tall. (I've seen many Academy ratio films there, so I feel I have a point of comparison). The subtitles were perfectly fine.
I normally wouldn't second-guess the people on this forum, but I remember it mainly because I was under the impression that it WOULD be 1:33.
That said, I have been wrong before . . .

solent

#57 Post by solent » Sun Jul 17, 2005 12:08 am

In the light of the JULES AND JIM error I would assume that MASCULIN (if 1.33:1) will be cropped slightly on the left and right. Whether this will matter in terms of text (so frequently used by Godard in this film) or in terms of the director's original intent is a matter for debate. It may not matter at all.

Did any of my fellow Australians watch this on SBS last year? Was the image full screen? I didn't bother to see it since I had the BFI video version.

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subliminac
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#58 Post by subliminac » Sun Jul 17, 2005 2:07 am

but I remember it mainly because I was under the impression that it WOULD be 1:33
Funny because I found the opposite to be true. I was expecting 1.66 and was surprised to find it 1.33. This at the Wexner Center in Columbus a few weeks ago.

I've always found this Godard to be a bit of a let down, especially in light of the earlier Karina movies. Chantal Goya is such a flat screen presence. All the female characters are disappointing really, and I'm always left with the suspicion that its due more to the desire to make a cohesive political statement than from its supposidly documentary elements. But then again, who's politics, Leaud's (Paul's)? Godard's?

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duane hall
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#59 Post by duane hall » Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:07 pm

I don't think Masculin-Feminin is at all intended to make a cohesive political statement. Rather, it presents the brash, idealistic milieu of Parisian youths attempting (feverishly, while trying to maintain an exterior of cool, natch) to tap into the zeitgeist. Whether or not Goya as Madeleine is an arousing screen presence isn't really the point. Paul (Leaud) is obsessed with her because of what she seems to represent, and we should very quickly catch on to how foolish Paul is. For the young characters of Masculin-Feminin, Marx, Coca-Cola, Pepsi, pop music are all phenomena which confer a cool-by-association. These phenomena are all suspiciously equated, levelled (prefiguring a postmodern condition.) The characters are not yet critical enough to notice the contradictions between the philosophies to which they (nominally) pledge allegiance and the lifestyles they lead.

In La Chinoise, the young would-be revolutionaries are more serious than the youths in Masculin-Feminin, but their seriousness also leads them (at least Wiazemsky's character) to become sadly more aware of their impotence. In Masculin-Feminin, on the other hand, the political engagement is more inchoate and superficial, and so their ignorance allows them more fun and freedom.

Regardless of Godard's sympathies when he made these films, I think that someone watching them now should not be overly concerned with the "political statements" and instead focus more on cultural dynamics, how the characters implement politics as part of an (idealistic and often confused) lifestyle.

All that being said, I found Paul's first conversation with Madeleine, and the later conversation with Catherine-Isabelle (when she's eating an apple) quite charming. A lot of that has to do with how Godard filmed these conversations. Godard was the one prompting the conversations, and then in the editing process he cut it together so it appears the youths are responding to each other, when in fact they are responding, rather coyly, to Godard. Also, Godard once again completely jettisons the shot-reverse shot editing of conversation, fixing the camera on just one of the characters for minutes at a time. This technique is incredibly refreshing and quite a relief from the way most contemporary films are edited.

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ellipsis7
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#60 Post by ellipsis7 » Mon Jul 18, 2005 1:25 pm

I wonder if the release date of this will slip... It's late being posted as a product page on amazon.com...

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The Fanciful Norwegian
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#61 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:32 am

The plot thickens regarding the AR. A couple of weeks ago I e-mailed Rialto and received this reply:
The correct aspect ratio is 1.66. Please let us know where you saw the film in a different ratio (was it 1.33 or 1.85?).
But today I got this from Mr. Mulvaney:
MASCULIN FEMININ's cinematographer Will Kurant confirmed that the intended aspect ratio for the film was 1.33:1. He also informed us that Godard told him to frame for both 1.33 and 1.66, because projectionists would often default to 1.66. However, the filmmakers' preferred aspect ratio is 1.33.
I'm inclined to take Kurant's word over Rialto's, although I suppose it's possible Kurant is misremembering what Godard wanted.

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GringoTex
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#62 Post by GringoTex » Tue Jul 19, 2005 11:20 am

The Fanciful Norwegian wrote: I'm inclined to take Kurant's word over Rialto's, although I suppose it's possible Kurant is misremembering what Godard wanted.
Godard despised 1.66 so Kurant's observation makes complete sense.

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Nihonophile
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#63 Post by Nihonophile » Tue Jul 19, 2005 1:24 pm

Langlois68 wrote:
The Fanciful Norwegian wrote: I'm inclined to take Kurant's word over Rialto's, although I suppose it's possible Kurant is misremembering what Godard wanted.
Godard despised 1.66 so Kurant's observation makes complete sense.
Do you have any quotes of him expressing his vitriol towards 1.66:1

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duane hall
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#64 Post by duane hall » Tue Jul 19, 2005 3:15 pm

Nihonophile wrote: Do you have any quotes of him expressing his vitriol towards 1.66:1
In a Decemeber 1962 interview with Cahiers (found in Godard on Godard)
Godard wrote:With Une Femme est une Femme, I also discovered 'Scope. I think it is the normal ratio, and 1:33 and arbitrary one. This is why I like 1:33 -- because it is arbitrary. 'Scope, on the other hand, is a ratio in which you can shoot anything. 1:33 isn't, but is extraordinary. 1:66 is worthless. I don't like the intermediate ratios. I thought of using 'Scope for Vivre Sa Vie, but didn't because it is too emotional. 1:33 is harder, more severe. I'm sorry, though, that I didn't use 'Scope for A Bout de Souffle. That's my only regret. Le Petit Soldat is correct as it is.

solent

#65 Post by solent » Tue Jul 19, 2005 5:56 pm

This is good detective work. Since I opened this debate I am now pleased to accept this information as a final conclusion and assume that Criterion, more often than not, stick to the filmmaker's original intentions.

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Kirkinson
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#66 Post by Kirkinson » Tue Jul 19, 2005 8:57 pm

Godard must have changed his opinion about 1.66 later on, seeing as Weekend and Tout va bien are in that ratio.

I do think Masculin Feminin is certainly 1.33, however. The comment from Rialto claiming 1.66 as correct is very suspect considering the trailer for M/F they put together themselves (which you can download at their web site) is exactly 1.33.

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GringoTex
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#67 Post by GringoTex » Tue Jul 19, 2005 11:16 pm

Kirkinson wrote:Godard must have changed his opinion about 1.66 later on, seeing as Weekend and Tout va bien are in that ratio.
I think by that point he had quit caring about "such trivial formal aspects" (as he might have put it) of the cinema.

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tavernier
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#68 Post by tavernier » Tue Sep 06, 2005 10:57 pm

Just got my copy of MASCULIN-FEMININ....haven't watched it yet, but the "more!" refers to two more extras: "Swedish telvision footage of Godard directing the 'film within the film' scene," and "video discussion of the film between French film scholars Freddy Buache and Dominique Paini."

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ellipsis7
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#69 Post by ellipsis7 » Thu Sep 08, 2005 1:07 pm

Also added is an archival i/v with Chantal Goya (in addition to the new one) and a 16 page booklet including the Martin essay but now plus a reprint of a report from the set by French journalist Philippe Labro. Last, there's a trailer for the original theatrical release as well as for the 2005 rerelease!

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FilmFanSea
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#70 Post by FilmFanSea » Tue Sep 13, 2005 12:22 pm

First review is up at Slant Magazine. An excerpt:
A spotless image in terms of dirt and specks, but edge enhancement is unseemly throughout (look at the windowsill at the beginning of chapter nine), and there's a graininess to the picture that's not exactly pleasant
Hmmm ... those on the fence may want to wait for the Beaver to compare the CC to the UK Nouveaux and/or the French Arte (no subtitles).

AZAI
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 6:17 am

#71 Post by AZAI » Mon Sep 19, 2005 1:51 pm

DVDBEaver ((http://www.dvdbeaver.com/film/DVDReview ... review.htm) is very positive about this release. although it does have quite some grain (like the slant review said)....but I kinda dig that.

What I actually like very much are the menus: Although very sober (simple black and white), they have a godardian feel to them, especially because it draws attention to the fonts......always so exceptional in Godard films.

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duane hall
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#72 Post by duane hall » Mon Sep 19, 2005 5:53 pm

Ah, looks excellent. Can't wait to dig into those extras when I get this disc in the mail (hopefully this week).

Now I wish the cover art were in a style similar to the satisfyingly simple menus.

Kudos to Goya, sporting the same haircut after all these years.

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lord_clyde
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#73 Post by lord_clyde » Wed Sep 21, 2005 9:00 am

Excellent! A fine movie, and a great presentation from Criterion.
I woke up early yesterday morning to trade in some dvds at my local MTC, because they have the best Criterion prices around (MSRP 29.99=19.99 and MSRP 39.99=32.99) but after all the trouble I went through of selling my crap they didn't get this or Naked. I am still worried about this turn of events as this is the first time the MTC has ever failed to get Criterions on release. So I hit up my friend who works at Media Play to use his employee discount and I ended up paying 20.75 for this, so I'm happy.
I would very much like to see a double disc reissue of Alphaville someday, and especially for Criterion to release Weekend, Pierrot La Fou, Breathless, and my favorite Godard My Life to Live. Does Criterion currently have the rights to any of these films?

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ellipsis7
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#74 Post by ellipsis7 » Wed Sep 21, 2005 9:20 am

I think PIERROT LE FOU is owned now by the CC, and should be released sometime... WEEKEND has just been released by New Yorker in R1 & AE in R2, so that's not coming...

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lord_clyde
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#75 Post by lord_clyde » Wed Sep 21, 2005 4:15 pm

I watched the original trailer, and I like the punchline more than the Rialto rerelease. It reminds me of Ebert's comments on Almost Famous, a film he believes every teenager should see but can't because of the R rating.

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