Criterion and Buena Vista

[jazzo]

So many possibilities, although top selections on my wishlist would probably be THE COLOR OF MONEY, NEVER CRY WOLF (especially since Ballard's THE BLACK STALLION is already in the collection), DOWN AND OUT IN BEVERLY HILLS and the astonishing all-but-forgotten TIN MEN (and if they could finagle the cross-licensing, DINER, AVALON and even LIBERTY HEIGHTS included in a dream "Baltimore Stories" box by Levinson).

Let's not forget a nice special edition of NEW YORK STORIES, or maybe the always delightful and elusive STAKEOUT.

I also wouldn't kick a proper release of HONEY, I SHRUNK THE KIDS for eating crackers.

[black&huge]

this isn't a joke post but I'm seriously hoping Armageddon and The Rock get upgraded.

[ryannichols7]

I know it's already on Blu-ray, but a Criterion 4K edition of Sleeping Beauty would be sublime. The Disney transfer is now more than a decade old.

Hoping that when Criterion says "our first collaboration with Disney" they mean "first of several" and not just "first ever."

Not to nitpick but it seems like an important distinction - they actually said it’s their first collaboration with “Pixar”.

on social media they've just said Pixar but the email says Disney too, which I find a bit interesting. I think all of us who regularly keep up with this label know Disney has basically always been a (very selective) Criterion partner since the laserdisc days - people on Twitter and Reddit still joke about the Michael Bay films.

so I have thought a lot about this announcement since first seeing it. it didn't shock me at all at first glance - the Pixar guys are all huge Criterion fans and have been very vocal about such for as long as I can remember. Lee Unkrich did a closet video, Brad Bird wants his pre-Pixar masterpiece in (and did Adventures in Moviegoing), and I swear I saw a top 10 from Pete Docter or Andrew Stanton sometime but may have been imagining it. Disney obviously is not at all interested in doing these themselves, and I can see them easily licensing out the non-franchised Pixar works, which would basically mean A Bug's Life, Ratatouille, and Up. Monsters, Inc got a sequel but it wasn't from Pete Docter (and I don't think Monsters University had as big of an impact despite being good) so I can see that being in play. The Incredibles and Finding Nemo are a little more interesting because they got sequels, but both of them were from the directors (Bird and Stanton) that worked on the originals. the big elephant of course is John Lasseter, I would give anything to see A Bug's Life, a supremely underrated film that literally owes everything to one of Criterion's flagship titles, but I don't know what they'll do about that situation. I think they'll play it safe and stick to Stanton, Bird, and Docter for the time being. Lee Unkrich would be great too for Coco eventually. I think Toy Story is off the table for the timebeing due to Lasseter and the fact that Disney does still see that franchise as a cash cow

I'm glad most of the comments I've seen online about this announcement are positive. it's really beneficial I think - Criterion gets more exposure and more revenue for projects we want to see them take on, and Disney/Pixar fans get to see definitive editions of movies we know wouldn't get released otherwise. it would be different if Disney was more like Universal or Warner and showed some interest in their catalog, but we know they don't. it's insane how none of the "first five" are available on 4K, let alone something like Sleeping Beauty. I would imagine if (and I think it will eventually happen) Criterion gets to dip into the classic Disney catalog, they will of course exclusively go for the pre-1988 stuff, though there is a case to be made about The Emperor's New Groove and Lilo and Stitch, two well loved films that have never gotten the love from the mouse they deserve.

as for Dead Presidents and The Straight Story, I'm sure its just a matter of time. I can't even imagine the take armageddon that would occur if they released Evita nowadays...ditto Michael Mann going revisionist on The Insider. or this entire thing could be a one off and we'll all look really silly, but I really doubt that to be the case. this has been a very well received announcement from what I see

[FrauBlucher]

No Disney films before The Little Mermaid have 4K releases, that entire Walt Disney Treasures line never made it to Blu-ray, and lots of the early Disney features have been censored or otherwise altered in some way for home video, so if this deal is a step in the direction of giving these films higher quality and more historically accurate presentations with scholarly context added for material now considered problematic, then great! But if not

This definitely seems like the most likely logical step if Disney is indeed lessening their physical media output. Plus, there seems to be a solid relationship with CC as they continue to release Fox titles. That well hasn't dried up as expected.

[captveg]

[M]y wishlist would probably be THE COLOR OF MONEY

You know, now that Disney owns both The Hustler and The Color of Money, those would make really appealing back-to-back spine numbers.

[beamish14]

So many possibilities, although top selections on my wishlist would probably be THE COLOR OF MONEY, NEVER CRY WOLF (especially since Ballard's THE BLACK STALLION is already in the collection), DOWN AND OUT IN BEVERLY HILLS and the astonishing all-but-forgotten TIN MEN (and if they could finagle the cross-licensing, DINER, AVALON and even LIBERTY HEIGHTS included in a dream "Baltimore Stories" box by Levinson).

Let's not forget a nice special edition of NEW YORK STORIES, or maybe the always delightful and elusive STAKEOUT.

I also wouldn't kick a proper release of HONEY, I SHRUNK THE KIDS for eating crackers.

Never Cry Wolf is at the top of my list as well. I’d love to see Criterion release more Carroll Ballard

Been waiting forever for solid discs of Honey, I Shrunk the Kids and the enormously entertaining Stakeout

Dick Tracy’s special edition DVD got cancelled. I really want to see its extended version

[swo17]

Is there a problem with the Disney Movie Club edition of HISTK?

[beamish14]

Is there a problem with the Disney Movie Club edition of HISTK?

Actually, I haven’t seen it! I assumed it was barebones like their other releases

[swo17]

I believe so but I think I remember the picture looking fine at least

[ryannichols7]

quite a thing to note that this is the first new Disney (excluding Fox) spine since Chungking Express was still a Disney holding (via Miramax). Criterion has since gotten the rights back to, and upgraded all ABC Pictures spines (excluding Spellbound) they previously held. no Touchstone titles have been upgraded aside from the three Wes Anderson ones. Kino is obviously the label who most recently got to dig into those catalogs

another note is that I do not believe Disney has ever put their own logo on any of the Criterion or Kino titles, or even their name on the back cover of any of these, only under ABC/Hollywood Pictures/Touchstone/Buena Vista. they're only mentioned by name in the "About the Restoration" section of Notorious. I have to assume that'll change for Wall-E?

[Quote Perf Unquote]

Two that I would love to see on 4K UHD: "The Black Hole" and "Tron"

They're both stupid as Hell as whole works of art, but both are visually stunning. Black hole has some of the last and finest use of matte work in the vivid stylized manner of "Black Narcissus." Tron of course is an important milestone in CGI, with great design by Syd Mead and Moebius.

Black Hole has only been available on BD from Disney's weird movie club, far as I know. Don't know how that works, but I see no general retail release. Tron you can now get for 5 bucks, general release, so who knows what's going on there.

[swo17]

The way the Disney Movie Club works is that you buy the movie on eBay from someone who is a member of the Disney Movie Club

[Quote Perf Unquote]

The way the Disney Movie Club works is that you buy the movie on eBay from someone who is a member of the Disney Movie Club

Haha, yes that's how I had to do it too

[jazzo]

Is there a problem with the Disney Movie Club edition of HISTK?

I just refuse to join the club for the three or four discs I’d be interested in, and dudes that sell them on Amazon want too steep a price for a barebones disc. At least, to me.

[movielocke]

I can't imagine Disney would license nor that criterion would be interested in releasing "Song of the South," especially after criterion released the Signifyin Works of Marlon Riggs just last year, which has a whole film that patiently explains why the stereotypes promoted, popularized and disneyfied are so poisonous to have as part of our culture.

Far more likely would be Criterion licensing Song of the South for a limited run on the Criterion channel, but given that pirates can probably rip from the channel, Disney probably wouldn't license it, because it would ultimately just mean putting a pristine copy into circulation.

Song of the South will be released when it enters public domain, and Disney won't be releasing it even then.

[swo17]

Guys, what about original versions of the original Star Wars trilogy, for all the "serious collector" types? Imagine all the money that would bring in

[vsski]

Do we really think Criterion could convince Lucas to do that, when they couldn’t even do that with someone like WKW, who seems to need money much more (given all the trinkets he selling outside his actual films)?

[black&huge]

not really the place for it but I didn't see anyone make this prediction over on the other forum but since this is happening maybe BU can finally work on Inferno unless they did have the rights all along somehow and have been quietly working on it but if not... Criterion. Just do it.

[swo17]

Do we really think Criterion could convince Lucas to do that, when they couldn’t even do that with someone like WKW, who seems to need money much more (given all the trinkets he selling outside his actual films)?

Lucas sold Disney the rights

[ryannichols7]

so I did research on this earlier because I was curious what the official word was - I remember when Disney bought Lucasfilm a lot of the speculation felt that they would put out the original versions, because Disney used to love money and would milk physical media with their various practices (who remembers "it's going back in the Disney vault"? the original boutique label scarcity!). obviously the new trilogy came and went and I didn't bother to even consider what the deal was on that to this day. apparently, and anyone more versed in Star Wars than me please feel free to correct/add on, but:

1. JJ Abrams apparently also wanted to see the original cuts considering y'know, he directed two of the new trilogy films. apparently he wasn't even allowed to view them himself!

2. the Library of Congress asked George Lucas for copies of the original versions and he denied them, which seems outrageously silly

I have to assume there's some sort of permanent damage/edits to the OCN, but apparently there are 4K sourced fan versions of them floating around on back channels with tons of film grain. its a possibility it was in Lucas' contracts with the conditions of the sale that the originals not be released - I feel we will someday hear more word about this. I'd be curious to read more about this if anyone has any insight, I'm not a fan of the films but I find this to be a particularly interesting issue. if they ever did get released, whether by Disney themselves or Criterion or any other boutique, I'm sure it would be an incredibly profitable product

[colinr0380]

Two that I would love to see on 4K UHD: "The Black Hole" and "Tron"

They're both stupid as Hell as whole works of art, but both are visually stunning. Black hole has some of the last and finest use of matte work in the vivid stylized manner of "Black Narcissus." Tron of course is an important milestone in CGI, with great design by Syd Mead and Moebius.

Black Hole has only been available on BD from Disney's weird movie club, far as I know. Don't know how that works, but I see no general retail release. Tron you can now get for 5 bucks, general release, so who knows what's going on there.

Very much seconded, and I would go as far as adding TRON: Legacy into that too.

And if we want to go for animation from Disney's 'dark period', add in The Black Cauldron too. That's so unjustly neglected and one of the few (only?) Disney films to follow through on actually permanently killing off the cute anthropomorphic supporting characters rather than just flirting with it. They made sure never to make that mistake again, instead just sticking to killing off parents at worst!

[swo17]

apparently there are 4K sourced fan versions of them floating around on back channels with tons of film grain

The last of them is all but finished so the timing would be perfect for an evil corporation to swoop in now and cash in instead

[beamish14]

apparently there are 4K sourced fan versions of them floating around on back channels with tons of film grain

The last of them is all but finished so the timing would be perfect for an evil corporation to swoop in now and cash in instead

Clips of the unaltered versions were shown in Disney+’s Industrial Light documentary from Lawrence Kasdan, and a 70mm print of the first film (possibly from the 1985 re-release, as I can’t imagine that a 1977 release print would not be completely faded) has been shown twice in recent years at AMPAS-sponsored events, so I’m guessing it’s not beyond the realm of possibility.

Lucas is a compulsive liar regarding the supposed degradation of their original camera negatives

[Roscoe]

Maybe, as with Chaplin's foolishness over preferring his butchering of THE GOLD RUSH, the original cuts of STAR WARS will have to wait for an "archival reconstruction" kind of thing after his death.

[Quote Perf Unquote]

I assume Swo's initial Star Wars comment was largely facetious, he might as well have said the Marvel Movies instead, so the last half dozen comments are pretty funny.

Of course that won't stop me from chiming in as well, because hey its Star Wars. As for Lucas, he's a fucking liar, but I'm happy with the 4K 77/80/83 projects. They look extraordinary. He and the various rights holders have had 40 years to get this right, or at least make a responsible effort, and they're obviously not interested.