The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

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bottlesofsmoke
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2021 12:26 pm

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#301 Post by bottlesofsmoke » Thu Feb 02, 2023 2:39 pm

1. The Apartment
2. La Notte
3. Charade
4. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance
5. Il deserto rosso
6. Pierrot le Fou
7. Le Trou
8. Au Hasard Balthazar
9. Repulsion
10. Une femme est une femme
11. Les Demoiselles de Rochefort
12. L'Avventura
13. Rosemary's Baby
14. La baie des anges
15. Les bonnes femmes
16. Blow-Up
17. Le Samourai
18. Loves of a Blonde
19. À bout de souffle
20. I fidanzati
21. L'Armée des ombres
22. Simon del desierto
23. Le Mépris
24. L'Eclisse
25. Masculin Feminin
26. Hatari!
27. Persona
28. Letter Never Sent
29. Hour of the Wolf
30. The Manchurian Candidate
31. Soy Cuba
32. Late Autumn
33. Winter Light
34. El ángel exterminador
35. The Nutty Professor
36. Playtime
37. L’enfance nue
38. Mouchette
39. La Voie lactée
40. Muriel ou le Temps d'un retour
41. Les Parapluies de Cherbourg
42. L'Année dernière à Marienbad
43. Bunny Lake is Missing
44. Vivre sa Vie
45. Petulia
46. Advise & Consent
47. Lilith
48. Thérèse Desqueyroux
49. Léon Morin, prêtre
50. Lola

La Baie des anges is my only orphan, I’m kinda sad I didn’t vote for The Young One (it was a close cut) since it got no votes at all.

I love to see Young Girls of Rochefort, Late Autumn (deservedly ahead of An Autumn Afternoon!), Masculin Feminin, and La Notte flying up the list. It’s fun to compare the yearly lists to this one, Simon of the Desert was #1 for 1965 but just 70th overall! Doubling the number of ballots will do that, plus I for one know I shifted my rankings quite a bit on reexamination, went more with my heart over my head.

Great job swo, on this list and all the lists. I love all the statistics, I find them fascinating to pour over. It will be really fun to compare them to the 1970s when we get there, to see the trends and shifts.

Making my list was incredibly hard, not so much the ordering but narrowing down the list to 50, I could have credibly made a top 250 and not felt like I was stretching. What a great decade for movies, as much as I love the classic Hollywood period, the 60s is definitely the best decade for movies, worldwide. I feel like I still have tons more to watch - and this list has surely added more - but now it is on to the 70s!

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Red Screamer
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#302 Post by Red Screamer » Thu Feb 02, 2023 4:06 pm

Thanks swo, and thanks everyone who took the time to write something thoughtful during this project.

Top 10 + Orphans

01 PlayTime
02 The Taste of Mackerel Pike
03 The Birds
04 L’Année dernière à Marienbad
05 Gertrud
+also ran
06 Les Demoiselles de Rochefort
07 Week End
08 Daisies
09 The Patsy
+orphan
10 La Jetée

21 Le Caporal épinglé
43 Le Lit de la vierge — to quote myself, a baroque and confrontational drone-rock Jesus nightmare whose mixture of coarse poetry, political anger, and low-budget inventiveness creates something of an unlikely crossroads between Godard, Carax, and Murnau.
46 Je t’aime, je t’aime

Everyone complained about the Sight and Sound list, but at least their voters had enough taste to chart my also rans The House Is Black, Wavelength, and The Cloud-Capped Star! Though neither list makes room for Wiseman or Lewis. It’s a sick world.

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zedz
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#303 Post by zedz » Thu Feb 02, 2023 5:52 pm

As promised, here’s my full list, only four of which made the final 100 (assuming that the film not called Walden at number 75 is actually Walden). Orphans unless noted.

1. Diamonds of the Night (Jan Nemec, 1964) NUMBER 56 – I’m glad this has risen up the list thanks to its newfound Criterion imprimatur, as it’s a perfect film.

2. Inferno of First Love (Hani Susumu, 1968) ALSO RAN – A film which actually made the Hot 100 last time, on the strength of a few powerful votes from, I guess, people who have died in the meantime. It’s a rich and disturbing tale of young love frustrated by prurient interests and stunted by abuse. The child abuse scenes remain queasy, even when we’re not even sure that’s what we’re looking at (actually, maybe that’s the most queasy thing about them), and there’s a central scene of hypnotherapy that’s brilliantly conceived, in which the therapist’s prompts (imagine the scene unfolding on a screen in front of you) and the patient’s response are so vivid that not only do we see his vision in those terms, but so does his attendant mother. Hani’s visual invention is exciting and on point throughout.

3. Arnulf Rainer (Peter Kubelka, 1960) ALSO RAN – The greatest of all flicker films. It’s like being taken over by an alien intelligence for 7 minutes. You can’t understand the language, but they’re screaming it inside your brain. It can and should only be seen in its originating media.

4. Violence at Noon (Oshima Nagisa, 1966) ALSO RAN – I think I had a few Oshimas last time, and his work in this decade is so accomplished and varied it was tempting to break my one-film-per-director rule (because there are so many great directors and films who deserve a place in my top 50) in his case. But I didn’t and this film won the rewatch steeplechase. It’s a serial killer movie / policier, but the key difference is that the focus is on two female victims – to the extent that
SpoilerShow
the arrest and conviction of the criminal is rendered off-screen, in voiceover.
Oshima’s radical deconstruction of film syntax is a major attraction here.

5. The House is Black (Forough Farrokhzad, 1963) ALSO RAN
6. A Quiet Week in the House (Jan Svankmajer, 1969) – Two utterly brilliant short films that haven’t really budged in my favour since my last 60s list. A Quiet Week in the House is like a mini-film festival of what makes Svankmajer sui generis. The House Is Black is directed by a woman and not on Criterion, so therefore doomed.

7. Dragon’s Return (Eduard Grecner, 1968) ALSO RAN – Another long-obscured masterpiece that I had hoped other people might have caught up with by now.

8. Brief Encounters (Kira Muratova, 1967) ALSO RAN – And – fingers double-crossed – I hope I’ll be saying the same about this film when the next vote rolls around (i.e. people interested in great filmmaking will at least have had the opportunity to see it.)

9. L’Enfance nue (Maurice Pialat, 1969) NUMBER 91 – This remains my favourite nouvelle vague film, maybe because it’s also one of the first films of the post-nouvelle vague vague that I find more interesting.

10. Reenactment (Lucian Pintilie, 1968) – My greatest discovery since last time, a self-reflexive tragic farce in which two friends are forced to restage a drunken fight for the sake of a PSA. Pintilie is a master of switching, compounding and undermining tones, and that skill gets its first major work-out here.

11. The Affair (Yoshida Yoshishige, 1967) – This was my top Yoshida pick last time and it retained that distinction. I also watched Affair in the Snow (which is drop dead gorgeous, but not as dramatically intense) and A Story Written with Water (which is wonderful, but not quite as formally inventive as this film from a couple of years deeper into Yoshida’s journey of formal perversity). If you think avant-garde melodrama is the kind of thing you’d take to, you need to see these films right away.

12. Black God, White Devil (Glauber Rocha, 1964) ALSO RAN – Still a marvel after all these years, and still surprising in new ways every time I watch it.

13. My Name Is Oona (Gunvor Nelson, 1969) ALSO RAN – Oona. Oo-na. Oonaoonaoona. Placed here as a special favour to therewillbeblus. Nah, it’s amazing and hypnotic.

14. Current (Istvan Gaal, 1964) ALSO RAN – Youthful alienation with a brilliant sense of place. In retrospect, a film that’s superficially similar to Reenactment, but very different in formal and dramatic terms.

15. Le Revelateur (Philippe Garrel, 1968) – Best religious epic of the decade performed by hippies and directed by aliens.

16. T,O,U,C,H,I,N,G (Paul Sharits, 1969) – Words fail me. Stroid.

17. The Fifth Horseman Is Fear (Zbynek Brynych, 1965) ALSO RAN – I’d seen this when I compiled my last two 60s lists, but its brilliance was far less apparent beneath the shitty patina of the Facets DVD, and the Second Run BluRay removed the scales from my eyes.

18. Fugitive from the Past (Ichida Tomu, 1965) – A great crime film with the added bonus of superb location work and plenty of weirdness.

19. Love at Sea (Guy Gilles. 1964) - A heterogenous compendium of the nouvelle vague that toggles between playful / serious, documentary / fiction, and left bank / right bank while shifting through epistolary, literary and theatrical narrative modes. With lots of in-jokes. Gilles has a great eye for composition: Classic black & white as well as a beautiful use of colour (e.g. primary smears in negative space, such as neon on rainy night streets).

20. Very Nice, Very Nice (Arthur Lipsett, 1961) - a.k.a. Parallax Corporation recruitment video v 1.0.

21. L’Hiver (Marcel Hanoun, 1969) – Another glorious nouvelle vague tangent. A filmmaker in crisis goes all self-reflexive in Bruges. The greatest of Hanoun’s seasonal quartet.

22. The Valley of the Bees (Frantisek Vlacil, 1968) ALSO RAN – This might be seen as the little brother of Marketa Lazarova, but I find it more immediate and impactful.

23. Walden (Jonas Mekas, 1969) NUMBER 75 – One of the decade’s ultimate everything-films. Mekas’ filmmaking is a Heraclitian river that I love to splash around in.

24. A Man Vanishes (Imamura Shohei, 1967) – This is best known as a notorious documentary whatsit, and it’s one of the greats of that subgenre, but it’s also an indelible record of Japanese society at various levels in the mid-60s.

25. Story of a Prostitute (Suzuki Seijun, 1965) – One of those Suzuki films where outlandish style happens to map perfectly onto serious subject matter - but I’m mainly here for the outlandish style.

26. Die Parallelstrasse (Ferdinand Khittl, 1962) ALSO RAN – As documentary whatsits go, A Man Vanishes has nothing on this film. The Oberhausen selection committee reconfigured by Franz Kafka. The clock is ticking and we’re as panicked and confused about what we’re supposed to do as they are.

27. The Red and the White (Jancso Miklos,1967) NUMBER 52 – This is another film that always seems fresh and unpredictable, perhaps because it eschews so many narrative norms.

28. An Untitled Film (David Gladwell, 1964) ALSO RAN – Who knew agriculture could be so apocalyptic? So many iconic images in so little time: the tattooed forearm and the chicken; the gaze of the boy in the apple tree; the cat’s descent. Probably the most beautiful film on my list.

29. Pirosmani (Gyorgy Shengelaya, 1969) ALSO RAN – Making a film about an artist that looks like the artist’s work is a risky gimmick, and this is probably the most successful example of that gimmick. It’s particularly impressive because Pirosmani’s style often confounds traditional perspective and naturalistic scale.

30. Lucia (Humberto Solas, 1968) – A sprawling epic of shorter epics that shows off Solas’ stylistic range while preserving thematic coherence. Like certain works of Godard and Fassbinder, it illustrates how Rocha was the key influence for radical cinema during this period.

31. Barrier (Jerzy Skolimowski, 1966) ALSO RAN – This film is wonderfully playful and accomplished. Its signature move is to set up a situation that’s surreal, threatening or bizarre, then belatedly resolve it with a realistic justification. Skolimowski does this time and time again, which places us in an unstable world of contingency and anxiety, but every little micro-resolution offers its own frisson of pleasure.

32. The Night of Counting the Years (Shadi Abdelsalam, 1969) ALSO RAN – Or, the film that time – and the World Cinema Project – forgot. Which is weird, as I would have thought this is one of the more commercially viable of its rescues.

33. A Well for the Thirsty (Yuri Ilyenko, 1965) ALSO RAN - Despite having its roots in rustic Soviet realism, this might be the trippiest movie on my list. Salt for Svanetia on bad acid, with Yoshida Bleach liberally applied.

34. The Sun in a Net (Stefan Uher, 1963) ALSO RAN – Like Die Parallelstrasse above it, here’s an instance where the first feature of a movement (the Czechoslovak New Wave, in Uher’s case) is a full-fledged masterpiece, and this film set the tone for a lot of the greatness that was to follow.

35. L’Immortelle (Alain Robbe-Grillet, 1963) – This film is awkward in so many ways, but it’s a profitable awkwardness, and I just love the way Robbe-Grillet trashes traditional film grammar in lock-step with his trashing of traditional narrative. The denouement is kinda dumb and obvious, but it’s a fun ride getting there.

36. Falling Leaves (Otar Iosseliani, 1966) – Iosseliani is a director who pretty much emerged fully formed, and this first feature has in general the same whimsical strengths (and whimsical limitations) as his final masterpieces. It’s a laidback, discursive series of skits loosely organized around some really terrible wine.

37. The Structure of Crystal (Krzysztof Zanussi, 1969) ALSO RAN – Zanussi’s first feature also stakes out territory he’d return to over and over again: namely, academic careerism and compromise. Wry, relaxed, subtly spiked, beautifully performed.

38. Samurai Spy (Shinoda Masahiro, 1965) – If I’m going to include an action movie on my list, it has to be this one, which is so wildly imaginative in the filming and staging of its action scenes and so ridiculously convoluted in its plotting that it’s some kind of abstract action apotheosis.

39. The Possessed (Luigi Bazzoni / Franco Rossellini, 1965) – Dark and moody recent discovery by Arrow that resonated more in my mind than any number of established classics when it came to compiling this list.

40. Pas de deux (Norman McLaren, 1968) ALSO RAN – Concerto for Dancers and Optical Printer.

41. 7362 (Pat O’Neill, 1967) ALSO RAN – Thrashing psychedelic machinery. Mr Kirlian, meet Mr. Rorschach.

42. Signs of Life (Werner Herzog, 1968) – I have no idea what production arrangements have made this debut feature comparatively scarce, but it’s one of my favourite Herzog films. I'm dumbfounded that this ended up an orphan.

43. Utek (Stepán Skalský, 1967) – Czech new wave obscurity that I’ve only ever seen on film. Runaway child encounters runaway soldier in a primal forest landscape. Maybe it’s nothing all that special in the grand scheme of things, but it’s emblematic of just how accomplished and innovative Czech filmmakers were if a film this good can be lost to posterity.

44. Samadhi (Jordan Belson, 1967) – A journey through the inner life of stars. Cosmic eye candy from the king of cosmic eye candy.

45. Chronicle of Anna Magdalena Bach (Danielle Hullet / Jean-Marie Straub, 1968) ALSO RAN – This complex, austere work is a lot of things, among them the best concert film of the decade.

46. Fire in Castille (José Val del Omar, 1961) ALSO RAN – A reasonably well-known film here but nowhere else. Val del Omar was one of the great cinematic innovators of this or any era, though the political and industry constraints of the time meant he had to express his astonishing vision through short documentaries about local places and events.

47. The Gladiators (Peter Watkins, 1969) – Like many of Watkins’ films, this highly political Squid Game proof-of-concept looks more and more prescient with time. Just because you’re paranoid doesn’t mean they’re not out to get you!

48. Charles Mort ou Vif (Alain Tanner, 1969) – As an oblique response to May ’68, this film plays better nowadays than many of the more direct ones. Tanner is another important filmmaker whose reputation has suffered from neglect and is well overdue for a revival.

49. Mingus (Thomas Reichman, 1968) – Rough and riveting portrait of the jazz great unravelling as he’s evicted by New York City. It would be nice if the direct cinema Mingus documentary we had was a joyous, celebratory one, but in the absence of that, I’ll take the harrowing, depressing one.

50. Christmas on Earth (Barbara Rubin, 1963) - Among the various “what is cinema?” provocations of the early 60s, this film goes the furthest of them all, and still has a daunting primal energy.

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therewillbeblus
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#304 Post by therewillbeblus » Thu Feb 02, 2023 6:03 pm

Lucia is so good, it probably would've made my list if I had revisited it. Same with Walden, which was near the top of my list when I submitted it a year ago. Not sure what happened there

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swo17
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#305 Post by swo17 » Thu Feb 02, 2023 6:41 pm

Just realizing that I actually have Pintilie's Reconstruction as eligible for the 1970 list, so technically I should have rejected zedz' vote for it here. Also, perhaps the film has other fans that weren't considering it as eligible for this list. I'm going to say it's still eligible for 1970, so you will all shortly have a second chance to follow his high recommendation there. (When the film was actually released is a separate matter. I see a lot of conflicting information about this--that it had a limited release in 1968, that it wasn't completed until 1969, that it played Cannes in 1970, that it did not play Cannes, that it had a wide Romanian release in 1970, that in 1969 it was banned for two decades, etc. I think there was information presented in the Romanian boxset that had me lean toward assigning it to 1970.)
zedz wrote:
Thu Feb 02, 2023 5:52 pm
42. Signs of Life (Werner Herzog, 1968) – I have no idea what production arrangements have made this debut feature comparatively scarce
It did just get a nice Blu-ray from Shout last year

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zedz
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#306 Post by zedz » Thu Feb 02, 2023 7:10 pm

swo17 wrote:
Thu Feb 02, 2023 6:41 pm
Just realizing that I actually have Pintilie's Reconstruction as eligible for the 1970 list, so technically I should have rejected zedz' vote for it here. Also, perhaps the film has other fans that weren't considering it as eligible for this list. I'm going to say it's still eligible for 1970, so you will all shortly have a second chance to follow his high recommendation there. (When the film was actually released is a separate matter. I see a lot of conflicting information about this--that it had a limited release in 1968, that it wasn't completed until 1969, that it played Cannes in 1970, that it did not play Cannes, that it had a wide Romanian release in 1970, that in 1969 it was banned for two decades, etc. I think there was information presented in the Romanian boxset that had me lean toward assigning it to 1970.)
I'll be happy to vote for it again in the next decades list!

I just went by the 1968 date on imdb, but reading the fine print there it seems like they're also very confused.

Oh, and there's another Reconstruction from 1970 that's also well worth checking out.

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Rayon Vert
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#307 Post by Rayon Vert » Thu Feb 02, 2023 10:21 pm

I'm embarrassed to say I've seen a grand total of 1 of zedz's top 50 films. But on the other hand, that means there's still an entire universe of less obvious cinema for me to discover eventually, perhaps.

With that caveat, my top 15:

1. Pierrot le fou
2. Dr. Strangelove
3. A Hard Day's Night
4. Au hasard Balthazar
5. The Battle of Algiers
6. L'Eclisse
7. Seconds
8. Le Trou
9. Le Deuxième souffle
10. Ma Nuit chez Maud
11. L'Armée des ombres
12. 2001: A Space Odyssey
13. Rocco and His Brothers
14. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance
15. Psycho

Masculin Féminin was no 27 for me. The Cloud-Capped Star was no 50 and it's likely that my ranking system favors older viewings. It will surely rise one day if I rewatch my entire collection!

Technically, it's probably French cinema that ranks highest for me this decade (from what I've seen, which leaves out filmographies from entire countries and continents), but my heart goes to Italy and its golden age.

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therewillbeblus
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#308 Post by therewillbeblus » Fri Feb 03, 2023 1:44 am

I'm pretty sure French and American tie at 17 for mine, just over a third each. I was surprised that Masculin Féminin finally overtook Pierrot le fou (my go-to for favorite film ever) at number 1, but it's reached the point where they're essentially interchangeable and the later film has been sitting with me a lot lately. If we did the 60s again for a third year in a row, it might change back, but it's probably time to move onto the 70s, even though plenty of people out there probably still wish that never happened

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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#309 Post by yoshimori » Fri Feb 03, 2023 1:44 am

Rayon Vert wrote:
Thu Feb 02, 2023 10:21 pm
I'm embarrassed to say I've seen a grand total of 1 of zedz's top 50 films.
I've seen most of zedz's list but am, nonetheless, shamed by its sheer idiosyncracy. Haven't seen the Grecner or Christmas on Earth, but will seek them out now.

I was one the other two votes for his 2 (the Hani) and, surprisingly, the only other vote for his 3 ("Arnulf Rainer"). We both ranked Oshima and Yoshida near the top, but with different films - mine were Boy and Story Written with Water. We both ranked a Suzuki and Shinoda, but again different films - Fighting Elegy and With Beauty and Sorrow for me. I do love the Lipsett he ranked, but I went with "21-87" instead of "Very Nice, Very Nice". We both recommend Pirosmani and Walden.

Happy to see Matsumoto's Funeral Parade of Roses get 5 votes after being orphaned in the 1969 list.

My also-rans and orphans include: Man without a Map (4), Fighting Elegy (7), Boy (8), Thomas, the Imposter (9), Satyricon (11), Passion of Anna (16), Otouto (Ichikawa, 17), Cul-de-sac (Polanski, 24), "Le Mystère Koumiko" (Marker, 28), China is Near (Bellocchio, 43), "Our Lady of the Sphere" (Jordan, 45), High School (Wiseman, 47), Scattered Clouds (Naruse, 49), maybe a couple others.

Six people voted for Point Blank! I had it in my top 10, but someone had it number 1. Anyone want to fess up? Like Petulia, the movie is total post-Resnais genius.

And, again, thanks to the list-wrangler.

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senseabove
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#310 Post by senseabove » Fri Feb 03, 2023 1:57 am

yoshimori wrote:
Fri Feb 03, 2023 1:44 am
Six people voted for Point Blank! I had it in my top 10, but someone had it number 1. Anyone want to fess up? Like Petulia, the movie is total post-Resnais genius.
Not my number 1, but it was the highest ranked new-to-me film on my list at 13!

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dekadetia
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#311 Post by dekadetia » Fri Feb 03, 2023 12:50 pm

It's not really my place to do it -- though I might be willing to take it on, time permitting -- but I'd love to see a centralized hub on Letterboxd for these lists in the form of a criterionforum user account. Would be pleased to share credentials with the mods for any edits/updates, and could even inquire about an HQ account if there's interest. Let me know what you think.

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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#312 Post by theflirtydozen » Fri Feb 03, 2023 1:06 pm

dekadetia wrote:It's not really my place to do it -- though I might be willing to take it on, time permitting -- but I'd love to see a centralized hub on Letterboxd for these lists in the form of a criterionforum user account. Would be pleased to share credentials with the mods for any edits/updates, and could even inquire about an HQ account if there's interest. Let me know what you think.
I think I'm the only one who has been making/sharing the LB lists for this most recent round of decades listmaking (can't get to processing these 60s results until next week), but it would be nice to have a dedicated account that could also collect other list project results.

Happy to share clones of the lists or my workflow for how I've streamlined the process of making the results (including the points notes for each list entry) into a list.

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geoffcowgill
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#313 Post by geoffcowgill » Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:30 am

Thanks for so meticulously compiling this, Swo17.

My picks:

1- 8 ½ [8 on master list]
2- Dr. Strangelove [6]
3- A Hard Day’s Night [47]
4- 2001: A Space Odyssey [1]
5- Viridiana [86 !?]
6- Lawrence of Arabia [64]
7- Persona [3]
8- Rosemary’s Baby [24]
9- Masculin Feminin [43]
10- The Graduate [21]

Also-rans
Orphans

13- Yojimbo
17- Knife in the Water
20- Tunes of Glory
23- Thunderball Yeah, that's right. A study in Hegelian dialectics wrapped up in a spy-franchise vehicle. Bond ultra.
24- Faces
27- Medium Cool
29- A Shot in the Dark No great pretense of cinematic art, but especially delightful physical comedy and clever gags, so much, just unbelievably, better than the other Pink Panther films. It makes me laugh as much as just about any other film.
32- In Cold Blood
33- A Woman is a Woman
34- In the Heat of the Night
35- Hud
36- Lolita
37- The Innocents
40- Wild River
42- Pigs and Battleships
44- The Pornographers Surprised this is an orphan.
45- Band of Outsiders That this is an orphan is, I guess, testament to the absolute glut of exciting '60s Godard.
47- Sanjuro Yikes, this was almost an orphan. Sorry to whomever placed it at #11 that I spared you a nice spleen-venting howl of righteous indignation.
49- Il Posto
50- David Holzman’s Diary

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therewillbeblus
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#314 Post by therewillbeblus » Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:38 am

geoffcowgill wrote:
Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:30 am
23- Thunderball Yeah, that's right. A study in Hegelian dialectics wrapped up in a spy-franchise vehicle. Bond ultra.
Please say more about this (here or in the James Bond thread)! Together, we can take on the world

ballmouse
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#315 Post by ballmouse » Sun Feb 05, 2023 5:53 pm

geoffcowgill wrote:
Sun Feb 05, 2023 11:30 am
45- Band of Outsiders That this is an orphan is, I guess, testament to the absolute glut of exciting '60s Godard.
47- Sanjuro Yikes, this was almost an orphan. Sorry to whomever placed it at #11 that I spared you a nice spleen-venting howl of righteous indignation.
I realized after I saw the final list that I must not have included Band of Outsiders. Oops.

Also, I am that guy who placed Sanjuro at 11. But I have plenty of orphans as is.

My also-rans
Yōjinbō (Akira Kurosawa, 1961) 32
The Bad Sleep Well (Akira Kurosawa, 1960) 40
Pale Flower (Masahiro Shinoda, 1964) 46
Hombre (Martin Ritt, 1967) 5
Per qualche dollaro in più (Sergio Leone, 1965) 31
Fail-Safe (Sidney Lumet, 1964) 16
Tunes of Glory (Ronald Neame, 1960) 12
Hud (Martin Ritt, 1963) 13
Classe tous risques (Claude Sautet, 1960) 35
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (George Roy Hill, 1969) 43
When a Woman Ascends the Stairs (Mikio Naruse, 1960) 39
Sanjūrō (Akira Kurosawa, 1962) 11
La Vérité (Henri-Georges Clouzot, 1960) 15
The Day the Earth Caught Fire (Val Guest, 1961) 28
Cool Hand Luke (Stuart Rosenberg, 1967) 41
El esqueleto de la señora Morales (Rogelio González, 1960) 36
King & Country (Joseph Losey, 1964) 47
La caza (Carlos Saura, 1966) 38

My orphans
The Lion in Winter (Anthony Harvey, 1968) 3
A Raisin in the Sun (Daniel Petrie, 1961) 24
The Angry Silence (Guy Green, 1960) 45
Sword of the Beast (Hideo Gosha, 1965) 42
Seven Days in May (John Frankenheimer, 1964) 48
The Misfits (John Huston, 1961) 27
Wings (Larisa Shepitko, 1966) 30
This Sporting Life (Lindsay Anderson, 1963) 44
Nothing But a Man (Michael Roemer, 1964) 23
Gate of Flesh (Seijun Suzuki, 1964) 26
Per un pugno di dollari (Sergio Leone, 1964) 33
Black Test Car (Yasuzō Masumura, 1962) 50

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Rayon Vert
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#316 Post by Rayon Vert » Sun Feb 05, 2023 6:34 pm

Third person here in the last few posts that had Tunes of Glory as an also-ran. Classe tous risques and The Day the Earth Caught Fire were among mine also. Didn't have a room for The Angry Silence as for many others, but that was excellent.

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swo17
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Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#317 Post by swo17 » Thu Sep 14, 2023 11:46 pm

swo17 wrote:
Mon Jan 16, 2023 2:58 pm
So this idea wasn't too popular in a poll, but if you'll all humor me, I'm interested in collecting some additional data beyond what's submitted in the 1960s lists. This survey will not affect the results of the list.

I have summarized as follows the films that placed on at least two top 5s during each annual poll, i.e. the ones most likely to make the final list. As it happened, there were exactly 200 of them:
SpoilerShow
À bout de souffle (Jean-Luc Godard)
Accident (Joseph Losey)
Adorable menteuse (Michel Deville)
Adua e le compagne (Antonio Pietrangeli)
Alphaville, une étrange aventure de Lemmy Caution (Jean-Luc Godard)
...And the Fifth Horseman Is Fear (Zbyněk Brynych)
Andrei Rublyov (Andrei Tarkovsky)
El ángel exterminador (Luis Buñuel)
L'Année dernière à Marienbad (Alain Resnais)
Antoine et Colette (François Truffaut)
The Apartment (Billy Wilder)
L'Armée des ombres (Jean-Pierre Melville)
Au hasard Balthazar (Robert Bresson)
L'avventura (Michelangelo Antonioni)
The Bad Sleep Well (Akira Kurosawa)
Bande à part (Jean-Luc Godard)
Bariera (Jerzy Skolimowski)
La battaglia di Algeri (Gillo Pontecorvo)
Before Tonight Is Over (Peter Solan)
Belle de jour (Luis Buñuel)
Les Biches (Claude Chabrol)
The Big City (Satyajit Ray)
The Birds (Alfred Hitchcock)
Blow-Up (Michelangelo Antonioni)
Les Bonnes Femmes (Claude Chabrol)
Bonnie and Clyde (Arthur Penn)
Breakaway (Bruce Conner)
Bunny Lake Is Missing (Otto Preminger)
Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo (Sergio Leone)
Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid (George Roy Hill)
Carnival of Souls (Herk Harvey)
Ce soir ou jamais (Michel Deville)
C'era una volta il West (Sergio Leone)
Charade (Stanley Donen)
A Charlie Brown Christmas (Bill Melendez)
Charulata (Satyajit Ray)
Chimes at Midnight (Orson Welles)
La Chinoise (Jean-Luc Godard)
La Cina è vicina (Marco Bellocchio)
Cléo de 5 à 7 (Agnès Varda)
Closely Watched Trains (Jiří Menzel)
La Collectionneuse (Éric Rohmer)
The Color of Pomegranates (Sergei Parajanov)
A Colt Is My Passport (Takashi Nomura)
The Cremator (Juraj Herz)
Culloden (Peter Watkins)
Daisies (Věra Chytilová)
David Holzman's Diary (Jim McBride)
The Day the Earth Caught Fire (Val Guest)
Death by Hanging (Nagisa Ōshima)
Les Demoiselles de Rochefort (Jacques Demy)
Il deserto rosso (Michelangelo Antonioni)
Deus e o Diabo na Terra do Sol (Glauber Rocha)
2 ou 3 choses que je sais d'elle (Jean-Luc Godard)
Le Deuxième Souffle (Jean-Pierre Melville)
Diamonds of the Night (Jan Němec)
Diaries, Notes and Sketches (Jonas Mekas)
Dillinger è morto (Marco Ferreri)
Divorzio all'italiana (Pietro Germi)
Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb (Stanley Kubrick)
Dog Star Man (Stan Brakhage)
La dolce vita (Federico Fellini)
Dutchman (Anthony Harvey)
Easy Rider (Dennis Hopper)
L'eclisse (Michelangelo Antonioni)
L'Enfance nue (Maurice Pialat)
The Fabulous Baron Munchausen (Karel Zeman)
La Femme infidèle (Claude Chabrol)
The Firemen's Ball (Miloš Forman)
The Flicker (Tony Conrad)
Fuego en Castilla (José Val del Omar)
Gare du Nord (Jean Rouch)
Giulietta degli spiriti (Federico Fellini)
The Graduate (Mike Nichols)
Il grande silenzio (Sergio Corbucci)
Harakiri (Masaki Kobayashi)
A Hard Day's Night (Richard Lester)
Hatari! (Howard Hawks)
The Haunting (Robert Wise)
Help! (Richard Lester)
High and Low (Akira Kurosawa)
High School (Frederick Wiseman)
A High Wind in Jamaica (Alexander Mackendrick)
Hour of the Wolf (Ingmar Bergman)
The House Is Black (Forough Farrokhzād)
Hud (Martin Ritt)
The Hustler (Robert Rossen)
I fidanzati (Ermanno Olmi)
If.... (Lindsay Anderson)
The Immortal Story (Orson Welles)
In Harm's Way (Otto Preminger)
Innocent Sorcerers (Andrzej Wajda)
The Innocents (Jack Clayton)
The Insect Woman (Shōhei Imamura)
Ivan's Childhood (Andrei Tarkovsky)
Je t'aime, je t'aime (Alain Resnais)
La Jetée (Chris Marker)
Judex (Georges Franju)
Jules et Jim (François Truffaut)
The Knack...and How to Get It (Richard Lester)
Kwaidan (Masaki Kobayashi)
The Ladies Man (Jerry Lewis)
Late Autumn (Yasujirō Ozu)
Léon Morin, prêtre (Jean-Pierre Melville)
Letter Never Sent (Mikhail Kalatozov)
Lilith (Robert Rossen)
Lolita (Stanley Kubrick)
Loves of a Blonde (Miloš Forman)
Ma nuit chez Maud (Éric Rohmer)
Il magnifico cornuto (Antonio Pietrangeli)
The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (John Ford)
The Manchurian Candidate (John Frankenheimer)
Marketa Lazarová (František Vláčil)
Marnie (Alfred Hitchcock)
La maschera del demonio (Mario Bava)
Masculin féminin (Jean-Luc Godard)
The Masque of the Red Death (Roger Corman)
Medea (Pier Paolo Pasolini)
Le Mépris (Jean-Luc Godard)
Midnight Cowboy (John Schlesinger)
Il momento della verità (Francesco Rosi)
Mothlight (Stan Brakhage)
Mouchette (Robert Bresson)
La muerte de un burócrata (Tomás Gutiérrez Alea)
Muriel ou le temps d'un retour (Alain Resnais)
The Naked Kiss (Samuel Fuller)
Night of the Living Dead (George A. Romero)
La notte (Michelangelo Antonioni)
One Plus One (Jean-Luc Godard)
One-Eyed Jacks (Marlon Brando)
8½ (Federico Fellini)
Pale Flower (Masahiro Shinoda)
Les Parapluies de Cherbourg (Jacques Demy)
Paris nous appartient (Jacques Rivette)
Pas de deux (Norman McLaren)
Passenger (Andrzej Munk & Witold Lesiewicz)
The Passion of Anna (Ingmar Bergman)
Peeping Tom (Michael Powell)
Per qualche dollaro in più (Sergio Leone)
Persona (Ingmar Bergman)
Petulia (Richard Lester)
Pierrot le fou (Jean-Luc Godard)
Plácido (Luis García Berlanga)
PlayTime (Jacques Tati)
Porcile (Pier Paolo Pasolini)
Il posto (Ermanno Olmi)
Pretty Poison (Noel Black)
La Prise de pouvoir par Louis XIV (Roberto Rossellini)
Profound Desires of the Gods (Shōhei Imamura)
Psycho (Alfred Hitchcock)
Que la bête meure (Claude Chabrol)
The Red and the White (Miklós Jancsó)
Red Beard (Akira Kurosawa)
Repulsion (Roman Polański)
Rocco e i suoi fratelli (Luchino Visconti)
Rosemary's Baby (Roman Polanski)
The Round-Up (Miklós Jancsó)
Le Samouraï (Jean-Pierre Melville)
The Saragossa Manuscript (Wojciech Has)
Seconds (John Frankenheimer)
Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors (Sergei Parajanov)
Shame (Ingmar Bergman)
The Shooting (Monte Hellman)
The Shop on Main Street (Ján Kadár & Elmar Klos)
The Silence (Ingmar Bergman)
Simón del desierto (Luis Buñuel)
Il sorpasso (Dino Risi)
Soy Cuba (Mikhail Kalatozov)
The Spy Who Came in from the Cold (Martin Ritt)
Sweet Charity (Bob Fosse)
Taste of Fear (Seth Holt)
The Taste of Mackerel Pike (Yasujirō Ozu)
Teorema (Pier Paolo Pasolini)
Thérèse Desqueyroux (Georges Franju)
They Shoot Horses, Don't They? (Sydney Pollack)
Through a Glass Darkly (Ingmar Bergman)
Tokyo Olympiad (Kon Ichikawa)
The Trial (Orson Welles)
Le Trou (Jacques Becker)
2001: A Space Odyssey (Stanley Kubrick)
Une femme est une femme (Jean-Luc Godard)
Il vangelo secondo Matteo (Pier Paolo Pasolini)
El verdugo (Luis García Berlanga)
Victim (Basil Dearden)
The Virgin Spring (Ingmar Bergman)
Viridiana (Luis Buñuel)
Vivre sa vie (Jean-Luc Godard)
La Voie lactée (Luis Buñuel)
War and Peace (Sergei Bondarchuk)
Week-End (Jean-Luc Godard)
What Ever Happened to Baby Jane? (Robert Aldrich)
Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf? (Mike Nichols)
The Wild Bunch (Sam Peckinpah)
Winter Light (Ingmar Bergman)
The Witchfinder General (Michael Reeves)
Woman in the Dunes (Hiroshi Teshigahara)
Yearning (Mikio Naruse)
Les Yeux sans visage (Georges Franju)
Yōjimbō (Akira Kurosawa)
Z (Costa-Gavras)
For anyone who is game, I have created the poll linked below to allow you to rank as many of these films as you like, in order of preference, beyond the ones that you like enough to already make your top 50. If you hate one of these films, I guess the best way to reflect that is to rank as many other films as possible above it. Again, this poll is optional and will have no bearing on the official results of the 1960s list.

1960s CONTENDERS POLL
I finally got around to processing all of the additional information that several of you provided earlier this year. Playing around with the results I came up with the following alternative top 100 for the 1960s which maximizes the power of every submitted vote. The basic idea is that every top 50 submitted potentially contains numerous "wasted" votes in terms of affecting the final list. For instance, if someone votes for 50 obscure favorites that all end up orphans, that person effectively has no say on the final top 100. But if I conduct multiple rounds of voting, each time eliminating "wasted votes," shifting all other films on that list up, and then padding out the remainder of that top 50 with ranked choices from the "contenders" list, that person can then have an influence on which contenders ultimately make the list and where. I've actually done several iterations of this for different sections of the top 100 for the 1960s. For instance, the last 20 or so entries on the top 100 assume that no one "wastes votes" on anything other than the 130 films that received the most support, while the top 10 positions eliminate all "wasted votes" beyond the 12 films with the most support. So at every point on the list, as much as possible, I've attempted to reflect as much information as I can about each participants' preferences.

Next to each film below I've shown how many votes got added from the contenders poll as well as the change in ranking compared to the published list based on the traditional tally approach. You can tell the final results are more reflective of more participants' tastes because most films now have more votes (and if they don't, they've probably moved down in position).

THE 1960s LIST - ALTERNATIVE TALLY

01. Persona (5 more votes, +2)
02. 2001: A Space Odyssey (3 more votes, -1)
03. Psycho (4 more votes, +1)
04. L'Année dernière à Marienbad (5 more votes, +1)
05. The Apartment (4 more votes, -3)
06. L'avventura (7 more votes, +4)
07. C'era una volta il West (4 more votes, same position)
08. 8½ (4 more votes, same position)
09. PlayTime (8 more votes, +5)
10. Dr. Strangelove or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Bomb (4 more votes, -4)
11. La dolce vita (4 more votes, -2)
12. Le Trou (5 more votes, +5)
13. Andrei Rublyov (3 more votes, -2)
14. High and Low (5 more votes, -1)
15. The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (5 more votes, +4)
16. Ma nuit chez Maud (7 more votes, +9)
17. L'eclisse (8 more votes, +6)
18. Blow-Up (5 more votes, +20)
19. Les Demoiselles de Rochefort (3 more votes, -7)
(tie) Harakiri (8 more votes, +23)
21. Rosemary's Baby (6 more votes, +3)
22. La Jetée (4 more votes, -2)
23. À bout de souffle (6 more votes, +3)
24. Seconds (6 more votes, +12)
25. The Birds (4 more votes, +9)
26. Il deserto rosso (3 more votes, -8)
27. The Graduate (5 more votes, -6)
28. Marketa Lazarová (2 more votes, -12)
29. Pierrot le fou (2 more votes, -14)
30. El ángel exterminador (6 more votes, +20)
31. Le Mépris (5 more votes, +6)
32. Z (4 more votes, +1)
33. Woman in the Dunes (2 more votes, -6)
34. Petulia (2 more votes, -4)
35. Il buono, il brutto, il cattivo (4 more votes, -4)
36. The Cremator (1 more vote, -15)
37. The Trial (no more votes, -9)
(tie) Giulietta degli spiriti (1 more vote, -8)
39. The Manchurian Candidate (8 more votes, +7)
40. They Shoot Horses, Don't They? (1 more vote, +11)
41. The Color of Pomegranates (1 more vote, same position)
42. Yearning (4 more votes, +19)
43. Late Autumn (2 more votes, -5)
44. Week End (1 more vote, -12)
45. The Wild Bunch (2 more votes, -1)
46. La battaglia di Algeri (4 more votes, -6)
(tie) Letter Never Sent (6 more votes, +21)
48. Simón del desierto (6 more votes, +22)
49. Au hasard Balthazar (3 more votes, -14)
50. Masculin féminin (2 more votes, -7)
51. Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors (1 more vote, +3)
52. Le Samouraï (5 more votes, +3)
53. Soy Cuba (6 more votes, +20)
54. La notte (1 more vote, -9)
55. Winter Light (5 more votes, +17)
56. The Red and the White (2 more votes, -4)
(tie) Diamonds of the Night (2 more votes, same position)
58. Daisies (1 more vote, -10)
59. The Big City (4 more votes, +23)
60. Death by Hanging (3 more votes, -3)
61. Rocco e i suoi fratelli (4 more votes, +2)
62. A Hard Day's Night (3 more votes, -15)
63. The Round-Up (1 more vote, +29)
64. Point Blank (no more votes, -6)
65. Through a Glass Darkly (3 more votes, -5)
(tie) Charulata (1 more vote, -12)
67. The Hustler (2 more votes, +7)
68. Jules et Jim (1 more vote, -6)
69. Les Bonnes Femmes (1 more vote, -21)
70. Midnight Cowboy (3 more votes, +10)
71. Diaries, Notes and Sketches (2 more votes, +4)
72. Marnie (4 more votes, +29)
73. The Taste of Mackerel Pike (1 more vote, -14)
74. The Shooting (1 more vote, -6)
75. Ivan's Childhood (6 more votes, +20)
76. La Collectionneuse (2 more votes, -1)
(tie) Chimes at Midnight (2 more votes, +8)
78. Il sorpasso (no more votes, +17)
79. L'Armée des ombres (1 more vote, -14)
(tie) I fidanzati (no more votes, -4)
81. Repulsion (1 more vote, -1)
82. Cléo de 5 à 7 (2 more votes, -12)
83. Night of the Living Dead (4 more votes, +24)
(tie) Belle de jour (2 more votes, -4)
85. Bonnie and Clyde (2 more votes, +10)
86. The Virgin Spring (2 more votes, -17)
87. Le Bonheur (no more votes, -21)
88. Who's Afraid of Virginia Woolf? (2 more votes, +1)
(tie) The Servant (no more votes, +16)
90. Vivre sa vie (2 more votes, -4)
(tie) Breakaway (1 more vote, +2)
(tie) The Firemen's Ball (2 more votes, +13)
93. Pale Flower (2 more votes, +33)
94. Le Deuxième Souffle (3 more votes, +26)
95. Muriel ou le temps d'un retour (1 more vote, -12)
96. Closely Watched Trains (3 more votes, +26)
97. Charade (3 more votes, -13)
(tie) Lawrence of Arabia (no more votes, -33)
99. Profound Desires of the Gods (1 more vote, +6)
100. Shame (2 more votes, +25)

PUSHED OFF THE LIST:

Les Parapluies de Cherbourg (was 78)
Funeral Parade of Roses (was 86)
Viridiana (was 86)
Eros + Massacre (was 89)
L'Enfance nue (was 91)
The Silence (was 94)
Elmer Gantry (was 98)
Il grande silenzio (was 98)
Zazie dans le métro (was 100)

Some other comments:

[*] Persona taking over the #1 spot generally results from that film appearing higher up on more contender lists than 2001. The implication is that quite a few more people had the Bergman film just missing their original top 50 while the Kubrick didn't have as much support outside of the people that included it in their original top 50.
[*] It may seem counterintuitive that Il sorpasso and The Servant moved up the list despite receiving no additional support in the contender poll. However, this can come about if someone originally voted for that film low on their top 50 below a lot of orphans. After removing all the "wasted votes" and moving things up, this can help a film's score. Essentially, people that had a lot of high-ranking orphans on their original top 50s didn't have as much voting power as others, so giving them that power now causes the contenders that they like to move up more than other films.
[*] There are also a lot of films that have more votes now but have moved down in position. I don't know if this is counterintuitive to anyone, but it generally happens because not every new vote is worth as much as others, among other things going on.
[*] Funeral Parade of Roses, Eros + Massacre, Elmer Gantry, and Zazie dans le métro were at a disadvantage in this process because they were not on the list of contenders, which had included every film that appeared on at least two top 5s during the individual year mini-lists. This is presumably because several people that voted for these films during the overall decade list did not participate in the individual year mini-lists. (Around 20 people have generally been participating in these lists compared to 34 participants in the overall 1960s list.) Otherwise, every film that proved to be a contender to make the final top 100 had been included on the contenders list.
[*] Other than the issue just described above, my process should theoretically be equivalent to running multiple rounds of a project, each time limiting which films you can vote for to the ones that have received the most support from others until finally getting down to a top 10 or whatever. In real life this might look like:

Round 1 -- Vote for the top 50 films out of all films from the decade. I publish the orphans.
Round 2 -- We've been doing this for a while as the "orphan rescue" round. You may want to revise your list at the end if you discover and decide to "rescue" someone else's orphan (or for any other reason).
Round 3 -- Vote for up to 50 films out of a list of ~200 films in contention for the final top 100. (A lot of this ballot might already be populated from the Round 1 vote, but with perhaps 5-10 films removed and the ability to expand your list back to 50.)
Round 4 -- Vote for up to 50 films out of this list of ~175.
Round 5 -- Vote for up to 50 films out of this list of ~150.
Round 6 -- Vote for up to 50 films out of this list of ~125.
Round 7 -- Vote for up to 50 films out of this list of ~100.
Round 8 -- Vote for up to 50 films out of this list of ~75.
Round 9 -- Rank this list of ~50 in order. (It wouldn't be necessary to vote for any films you didn't want to receive points.)
Round 10 -- Rank this list of ~25 in order.
Round 11 -- Rank this list of ~10 in order.

You could do less rounds than this but the longer you draw it out the better chance lower-ranking films have of finally getting enough support to avoid premature elimination.

Probably some people would not have the patience to go through all these rounds, but they would each be optional. You might go through a few of them and then decide you don't care anymore. Actually, every film you have already voted for would count in subsequent rounds (unless that film has been eliminated due to not having enough support from others). The whole point of submitting a new vote in a new round then would be to allow you to fill out the bottom of your list with films you had not already voted for, to the extent that you have room to do so after more and more films are eliminated each round. Adding these votes to the bottom of your list in subsequent rounds allows you to express whether certain films that didn't originally make your top 50 just barely missed out, whether you approve of them performing well even if they're not quite personal favorites, or whether you despise them (in which case you may not want to assign them any points even if you have room to do so).
[*] The alternative to having people actually vote in numerous rounds is for me to perform those rounds myself based on the results of a contender poll. However, this is not necessarily less work for participants than having multiple rounds of voting would be. The contender list for the 1960s was 200 titles long and there were some people that ranked nearly all of them for the contender poll! However, by the time I got that far down on those contender ballots, the majority of the films being voted for had already been eliminated in prior rounds. Ultimately, participants might only need to vote for 25-50 more films under the multi-round approach to have a full say on the final list as opposed to 150-200 under the contender poll approach.
[*] Obviously I find these kinds of statistics fascinating, so I'm happy to keep tabulating them to the extent that people are willing to provide me with the data necessary to do so. This alternative tally approach could remain just that, an alternative, or it could perhaps replace the traditional tally approach if enough people want that. Or it could also die on the vine if no one wants to do a contender poll again. I'm here for whatever.
[*] Perhaps what I'm describing is too complicated for some of you, which is fine. Again, even if we started doing multiple rounds of voting, there would be no need for anyone to do anything more than submit a top 50, if that's all they want to do. Any participation beyond that would simply be to maximize the power of each of your votes. Without naming names, I'll just say there were two participants that submitted 1960s lists that were mostly orphans and only had I think two films each that they originally voted for appear on the final top 100. One of these participants did not participate in the contenders poll while the other submitted a very lengthy contender list. In both cases, each person still ended up with a ton of orphans, but the one that submitted a contender list ended up having some say in the final position of every single title on the alternative tally list above.
[*] For what it's worth, I initially had the idea to perform a tally this way following the contentious results of the last Sight & Sound poll, where a fair number of participants disagreed with some of the films that placed the highest. I continue to suspect that instituting multiple rounds would improve any voting system's ability to represent its participants' preferences (ranked-choice voting anyone?). For comparison purposes, here is how our 1960s list might have looked under the S&S approach, if I make the crude assumption that an all-time top 10 might correspond to a top 1 for a decade:

01. 2001: A Space Odyssey (4)
02. À bout de souffle (2)
(tie) L'Année dernière à Marienbad
(tie) The Apartment
(tie) Marketa Lazarová
(tie) Week End
(tie) The Wild Bunch

Not a bad list actually, but it only barely hints at a consensus of our collective tastes

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Toland's Mitchell
Joined: Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:42 pm

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#318 Post by Toland's Mitchell » Fri Sep 15, 2023 12:02 pm

Another great list, and interesting how the contender lists shook up the final list. Your comments clearly explained how some movies move down despite more support, while others move up with no additional support. Fascinating indeed, while perhaps more accurately reflecting everyone's tastes. In the 1960-1976 mini-lists, my participation rate is about 65-70% so I haven't been fully doing my part in determining what gets on the contender ballot. But when it comes to crunch time for full decade lists (70s and so on), I don't mind voting in multiple rounds, providing a 50-film contender list, or providing whatever other data you want to collect.

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swo17
Bloodthirsty Butcher
Joined: Tue Apr 15, 2008 10:25 am
Location: SLC, UT

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#319 Post by swo17 » Fri Sep 15, 2023 1:10 pm

I might add that the above results were based on 13 of the 34 list participants submitting a contender ballot. Perhaps that's all the interest there is in additional participation, but if more people joined in, it could shake up the results even further

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TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
Location: Stretford, Manchester

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#320 Post by TMDaines » Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:32 am

I never posted my ballot, but went for:

Top 10:

#1) Psycho (Alfred Hitchcock - 1960 - United States)
#2) C'era una volta il West (Sergio Leone - 1968 - Italy)
#3) La jetée (Chris Marker - 1962 - France)
#4) Il sorpasso (Dino Risi - 1962 - Italy)
#5) Le Mépris (Jean-Luc Godard - 1963 - France)
#6) The Graduate (Mike Nichols - 1967 - United States)
#7) Il grande silenzio (Sergio Corbucci - 1968 - Italy)
#8) Ma nuit chez Maud (Éric Rohmer - 1969 - France)
#9) Rocco e i suoi fratelli (Luchino Visconti - 1960 - Italy)
#10) 8½ (Federico Fellini - 1962 - Italy)

Orphans:

#11) La ragazza con la valigia (Valerio Zurlini - 1961 - Italy)
#22) Il bell'Antonio (Mauro Bolognini - 1960 - Italy)
#25) Un homme et une femme (Claude Lelouch - 1966 - France)
#27) Viy (Georgi Kropachyov; Konstantin Yershov - 1967 - Soviet Union)
#31) Boxer a smrť (Peter Solan - 1963 - Czechoslovakia)
#39) Vu du pont (Sidney Lumet - 1962 - France)
#40) Abschied von gestern (Alexander Kluge - 1966 - Germany)
#41) What Ever Happened to Baby Jane? (Robert Aldrich - 1962 - United States)
#46) Una vita difficile (Dino Risi - 1961 - Italy)

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thirtyframesasecond
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2007 1:48 pm

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#321 Post by thirtyframesasecond » Wed Feb 07, 2024 4:39 pm

I haven't contributed to these decade polls for about a decade, but the top ten I submitted last time round (2013?) probably remains current enough.

Les Yeux Sans Visage (Franju)
2001: A Space Odyssey (Kubrick)
Il Gattopardo (Visconti)
Le Mepris (Godard)
Seconds (Frankenheimer)
Devi (Ray)
Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors (Parajanov)
Repulsion (Polanski)
The Cow (Mehrjui)
Teorema (Pasolini)

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domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#322 Post by domino harvey » Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:31 pm

TMDaines wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:32 am

#11) La ragazza con la valigia (Valerio Zurlini - 1961 - Italy)
Great movie, just didn’t have room for it. Maybe it’ll get a nice boutique label release one of these days

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Randall Maysin Again
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2021 3:28 pm

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#323 Post by Randall Maysin Again » Wed Feb 07, 2024 7:31 pm

TMDaines wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:32 am
#10) 8½ (Federico Fellini - 1962 - Italy)
O, for the critical skills to finally drive a stake through the heart of this stupid gushy movie's reputation once and for all. Well, that's not me! Carry on!

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TMDaines
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 pm
Location: Stretford, Manchester

Re: The 1960s List: Discussion and Suggestions

#324 Post by TMDaines » Thu Feb 08, 2024 9:04 am

domino harvey wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:31 pm
TMDaines wrote:
Wed Feb 07, 2024 6:32 am

#11) La ragazza con la valigia (Valerio Zurlini - 1961 - Italy)
Great movie, just didn’t have room for it. Maybe it’ll get a nice boutique label release one of these days
It feels pure Radiance. There's a legit Spanish Blu-ray, but barebones and slightly shorter than the NoShame DVD, I think.

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