Joe Dante

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Roger Ryan
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Re: Joe Dante

#176 Post by Roger Ryan » Thu Dec 22, 2022 5:16 pm

domino harvey wrote:
Thu Dec 22, 2022 2:42 pm
Also, having now seen it on real menus in restaurants, apparently peanut butter does make the burger!
The year before Twilight Zone - The Movie was released, I enjoyed a peanut butter burger at a bougie restaurant in Southern California. In the cinema a year later I nodded my head in recognition when Kevin McCarthy insincerely endorsed it in the film.

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#177 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Dec 28, 2022 9:15 pm

domino harvey wrote:
Sat Oct 30, 2010 5:14 pm
Speaking of poorly-functioning satire, I thought Homecoming was kind of awful and full of ham-fisted, liberal-baiting jibes at the Iraq war. As far as its effectiveness as political commentary, forget about it. I mostly share the pic's ideology, but there's something to be said for a defter touch (or a smarter one).
Yeah, this was a big eye-roller. Thea Gill threatens to save the episode on a few occasions, but that would require a more nuanced direction from this one-track material. One has to wonder what the purpose was for detailing her character and the central dynamic as much as it is, if she’s just going to be used as a dismissed “worse than me” point of comparison for the man to grow a heart three sizes, or whatever.

Dante’s other Masters of Horror episode, The Screwfly Solution, fares better, because its social politics are less didactic and the happenings pull no punches by venturing into darker and darker territory over the course of an hour. Dante’s earlier balanced style is missing, and this is surely an absurd and inconsistently involving narrative at best, but there’s a lot to admire about Dante’s bald refusal to compromise on emphasizing the corporeal horrors contained in this script. The basic premise is that, for reasons explained only at the end in an unsurprising Twilight Zone / Outer Limits-esque reveal, men in the U.S. begin committing femicides as a sort of psychological epidemic, igniting all their aggressive impulses towards the gender they breed with and essentially deleting their humanity in the process. While some of the earlier action feels a bit forced for the sake of inserting violence and sexuality for late-nite sport, this conceit is truly pushed to its limits once the skinamax quotas are met, and clever probabilities from the apocalyptic scenario are introduced. My favorite being the way that a male-based government militia opts out of supporting the logical solution proposed by scientists to mandate castrating all men to save the species, which hits a lot of targets without aiming directly for them. And then there are the ever-escalating disturbing set pieces involving various unprompted sexual and violent assaults by multiple characters in both private and public spaces (one featuring harassment from a construction crew and a vehicular homicide occurring simultaneously is a reminder of Dante’s spacial skills at staging and executing multiple moving parts in realising a schematic interpretation of events). All in all it’s ‘fine’, but the cynical denouement fits with the relentless forward momentum of the episode- one where we don’t stop to really care about anyone, and are finally left with the personified last hope standing, without anyone to care for her- even the audience, who sympathizes more for a conceited place of self-preservation. It’s a self-consciously intelligent slap in the face.

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Maltic
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Re: Joe Dante

#178 Post by Maltic » Thu Dec 29, 2022 10:18 am

Homecoming (I haven't seen it) was the one time where Dante sort of "played it straight" right? He must've been really pissed off by the Iraq War and the GWoT (rightfully so)... and fed up with the movie industry.

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#179 Post by therewillbeblus » Thu Dec 29, 2022 12:21 pm

Depends on what your definition is of “playing it straight” - it’s more obviously fitting with a satirical tone he’s used to adopting, though arriving at a far lamer and curiously sincere dramatic denouement than what we usually get. But The Screwfly Solution barely feels satirical in comparison. Its harrowing aspects overwhelm the opportunities for wry humor across the witty suppositions he films from the story, so in a sense that one is played straighter but the execution of content deserves its more serious approach

I haven’t seen a ton of Masters of Horror eps in general, but I watched Tobe Hooper’s recently as well, and it’s incredibly dark, even for him, which makes me wonder how much creative control these auteurs have over the tone of their episodes. They all more or less play out with the same dominant bleakness, and you have to search for their idiosyncratic interests beneath that veneer

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Maltic
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Re: Joe Dante

#180 Post by Maltic » Thu Dec 29, 2022 2:13 pm

Yeah, I guess I meant sincere in a way that didn't suit him.

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#181 Post by therewillbeblus » Sat Jan 07, 2023 1:20 pm

I just revisited and made my way through all unseen Dante work available to me, and was disappointed that there were very few diamonds to be discovered. He's a wonderful filmmaker who never got to live up to his potential, showcasing a keen sensibility in merging deep, humanistic themes with visual storytelling under the umbrella of narrative economy and prioritization of entertainment value, but only really across a handful of works, if that. Aside from Matinee, his It's a Good Life rendition, The Burbs, and to a lesser extent Gremlins 2: The New Batch, I'm not sure there are any real masterpieces left. Small Soldiers is a slight return to form in low-key fun, Innerspace is mostly amusing but inconsistent fluff, and the first Gremlins is fine, but nothing else gave a glimpse of his clear abilities defined in those top-shelf films. Looney Tunes: Back in Action is decent, and I really wanted to like Burying the Ex off the strength of Ashley Greene’s performance alone, but she can’t save a weak film that Dante’s soft approach doesn’t help because its entrusted to a script and characters with no flavor.

Speaking of Gremlins, I've never understood its cult status, and liked it even less on my previous watch a couple years back, but this last one demonstrated some worthwhile merits- especially that deliberately-PG-pushing kitchen scene where the mom brutally kills three evil gremlins before we have a strong sense of what their threat level is, barely even giving us a visual representation of their difference from Mogwai before eliminating them as pests- which is the minimum requirement for earning such a massacre. The scene feels so self-consciously geared at pushing the PG rating by engaging with simultaneous signifiers of PG and R optical conjurings: Dante being a filmmaker with strong visual prowess and comprehension on how to introduce monsters, threats, etc. in order to give audience a smooth ride in accepting their 'other'ness, as well as the way the scene plays out as both silly, family-oriented cartoonishness an acute crisis of alien invasion into the nuclear safe space of the family home, complete with shadowing the figures themselves and then offing them at a relentless speed. Anyways, a brilliant execution of a scene amidst a so-so movie. The sequel, on the other hand, I only appreciate more on each outing. I liked it as a kid too, but understanding the acidic corporate satire and creative homages to animated auteurs helps a lot.

I hadn't seen It's a Good Life since I was quite young, but having worked with children Anthony's age for the last 15 years, it plays way better - especially given that he's a spitting image in both his behavior and hold over adults to a few particularly-coddled kids I've counseled in real life. The episode is at once pitching its focus on leisurely pleasures from the medium, and also commenting on not just the dangers of overindulging children, but the tragic reality that kids crave containment and that the adults who passively avoid setting limits and reinforce the attitude that "my kid should be happy all the time" are doing their kids a disservice. Even more poignant, the episode postures at how they're really doing so for their own benefit of decreasing discomfort in forsaking skill-building in their kids, rather than in empathy for the children themselves- a fear-based evasion of asserting uncomfortable agency. The ending that calls of harmony under authoritative parenting is inspiring, and I agree with those who say this is amongst his best work- it's a concise amalgamation of everything that makes Dante a unique and vital voice in cinema.

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Yakushima
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Re: Joe Dante

#182 Post by Yakushima » Sat Jan 07, 2023 3:08 pm

Therewillbeblus, have you watched Dante's The Hole (2009)? To me it was one of his very best, nearly at the level of The Burbs and Matinee, and on a recent re-watch I liked it even more.

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#183 Post by therewillbeblus » Sat Jan 07, 2023 3:37 pm

Yakushima wrote:
Sat Jan 07, 2023 3:08 pm
Therewillbeblus, have you watched Dante's The Hole (2009)? To me it was one of his very best, nearly at the level of The Burbs and Matinee, and on a recent re-watch I liked it even more.
I did, and unfortunately it did very little for me. I respect the charities cast its way from domino, because it is admirably engaging with kids on an adult level through visual themes of processing traumas in a manner we can only really appreciate in adulthood looking back. Dante understands that kids have a higher emotional intelligence and general consciousness to a mature part of their psyches that often goes uncredited since their behavioral immaturities demonstrate a dissonance between what they can access internally and how to cope with it, and he risks having no audience for his film by showcasing this perceptiveness in an narrative form like this. All that said, I just didn’t think it made for solid entertainment, as the limitations of the visual medium (ironic given Dante using his strongest set of skills) only served as the same barrier. Yes, these kids are deeper than they let on, but when that humanistic depth is clouded by what felt to be uninspired devices and impulsively immature lines, it’s a reminder why they aren’t treated like adults. An example is the recurring innuendo of Haley Bennett referencing the boys playing with holes, which is progressive I guess in showing how teenage girls do indeed engage in sexual provocations and it’s perhaps even self aware of the thematic presentation of immature defenses shielding vulnerable experienced humans underneath, but it’s also emblematic if the film’s trend of comedic, thematic, and narrative non-starters. I didn’t think the film was very fun, had a hard time caring about the characters, and so I was left with the intellectual angle, but it’s hard to give something analytical rope when it doesn’t seem to care itself about drawing those connections. There isn’t anything particularly inviting to bridge the developmental observations into entertainment, unlike Small Soldiers, which I think is making more of an effort here (oddly pointed at commentary I less personally interested in than The Hole’s) but still not offering up much more than a different approach to something familiar. I didn’t think that The Hole was showing me anything new or familiar in a new way, and this was extra disappointing because I believe that it is aware of its potential to do just that. I’ll have to watch it again sometime and see if I feel differently- but I’d definitely be interested in listening to a defense to perhaps prompt that revisit sooner!

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Maltic
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Re: Joe Dante

#184 Post by Maltic » Sat Jan 07, 2023 4:35 pm

Have you seen The Hole in 3D? I've been curious about this. I have yet to see it in any format.

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Yakushima
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Re: Joe Dante

#185 Post by Yakushima » Sat Jan 07, 2023 6:31 pm

Thank you, Therewillbeblus, this is a very interesting analysis. I would have to re-watch it to discuss its merits more comprehensively. My memory of the two viewings is that I enjoyed it as a little horror film with engaging characters who are fighting against their inner demons. The story was interesting and more coherent than in some other Dante's efforts.

Maltic, I have not seen it in 3D. I imaging it would be quite disturbing!

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Re: Joe Dante

#186 Post by beamish14 » Sat Jan 07, 2023 6:48 pm

Yakushima wrote:
Sat Jan 07, 2023 6:31 pm
Thank you, Therewillbeblus, this is a very interesting analysis. I would have to re-watch it to discuss its merits more comprehensively. My memory of the two viewings is that I enjoyed it as a little horror film with engaging characters who are fighting against their inner demons. The story was interesting and more coherent than in some other Dante's efforts.

Maltic, I have not seen it in 3D. I imaging it would be quite disturbing!
I remember hearing about how impressive the 3D was in it, but the film didn’t get a commercial theatrical release in North America.

It really seems like the industry basically relegated Dante to small projects and episodic TV gigs after Looney Tunes: Back in Action, a film he stepped into at the 11th hour and knowing that it didn’t have a completed script, like Explorers. Dante is a remarkably kind man and insanely knowledgeable film buff. Many of the materials that him and producing partner Jon Davison have deposited at the Academy Film Archive are insanely scarce.

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swo17
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Re: Joe Dante

#187 Post by swo17 » Sat Jan 07, 2023 7:05 pm

Looks like it got a 3D Blu-ray release in every country besides the U.S. I'm curious to import one of them

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#188 Post by therewillbeblus » Sat Jan 07, 2023 7:57 pm

Yet another nudge to get that 3D setup

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#189 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Feb 01, 2023 1:45 am

It only took til the final stretch of Eerie, Indiana for the creators to reveal their politics. "No Brain, No Pain" is filled with such nonchalantly flippant digs at liberals that even a show as baldly silly as this one can't be mistaken as anything but sincere in its conservative attitudes. More than just a reflection of being knee-deep in the Bush Sr. era and riding the high of Reagan's ideology, the jokes aimed at left-wing folks almost seem alien in being cast to wide audiences supposedly universally accepting of the punchlines. It starts out with the double-take variety, when after Marshall's parents embrace a derogatory remark about the presence of a "liberal" in Eerie, Marshall -like any kid eagerly curious about what his parents are talking about- asks what a "liberal" is, and his parents look at one another awkwardly and anxiously rebuff the question with, "We'll tell you when you're older" - How this plays out and the inappropriate connotation as evidenced by the embarrassed reactions of the parents implies that talking about "liberals" may as well be in the same ballpark as asking what a "whore" or a "terrorist" is. The 'other'ing dynamics continue to be woven seamlessly into the episode by all characters without a single nudge that this is all part of a satirical extended bit, but because the disses come embedded in the punchlines of jokes, yet pitched earnestly as part of those gags, it just plays out so... strange. I guess the weirdest thing about a show about weird goingons isn't the time traveling or tornado-riding or man-eating dogs or the girl who paints things and wills them into fruition... it's the myopic assumption the show seems to hold that audiences across the country in '91 are homogeneously not only in support of the Republican party, but cannot conceive of another perspective and group the left in with the most deviant trolls lurking in the underbelly of America. The best line comes at the end though, when the "most brilliant scientist who ever lived" begins to explain how folks began to use his brain-machine for capital gain by "brokering a deal to put MacGyver's brain in Ronald Reagan, quadrupling its size!" Yes that's funny, but there's zero indication that the writers and I are on the same page about why

Also, great as this show is, the late-season presence of Jason Marsden's character is beyond grating. His developing arc suggests he may've been in it for the long haul, so maybe it was a blessing this was canceled after all

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Re: Joe Dante

#190 Post by ford » Wed Feb 01, 2023 3:25 pm

therewillbeblus wrote:
Wed Feb 01, 2023 1:45 am
It only took til the final stretch of Eerie, Indiana for the creators to reveal their politics. "No Brain, No Pain" is filled with such nonchalantly flippant digs at liberals that even a show as baldly silly as this one can't be mistaken as anything but sincere in its conservative attitudes. More than just a reflection of being knee-deep in the Bush Sr. era and riding the high of Reagan's ideology, the jokes aimed at left-wing folks almost seem alien in being cast to wide audiences supposedly universally accepting of the punchlines. It starts out with the double-take variety, when after Marshall's parents embrace a derogatory remark about the presence of a "liberal" in Eerie, Marshall -like any kid eagerly curious about what his parents are talking about- asks what a "liberal" is, and his parents look at one another awkwardly and anxiously rebuff the question with, "We'll tell you when you're older"
I dunno, that sounds like it could've been a pretty good zinger from Hank Hill.

Twin Peaks could be said to be a call for an Eisenhower-esque renaissance for an America festering with 1960s/70s "permissiveness" around drugs and sex. The hero is, after all, a morally upright member of J Edgar Hoover's FBI. And we know that Lynch was, for a while, some kind of Reagan Republican.

But who cares? Great show.

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Re: Joe Dante

#191 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Feb 01, 2023 3:43 pm

Have you seen the episode I'm talking about? If you see it, rather than 'sound' it out or whatever, I think you'll understand - it's not something that's easy to explain, and I'm not suggesting that the show is not great because of the episode's politics. I could care less if a show or film or person is liberal or conservative- I like great works from all parties. I'm detailing a strange vibe where according to the established logic of the episode's jokes' deliveries, they seem to be relentlessly yet casually alienating "liberals" as a kind of foreign group without inviting self-consciousness. It's the weirdness of the approach that struck me, not that there was a political approach made in general

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Mr Sausage
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Re: Joe Dante

#192 Post by Mr Sausage » Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:19 pm

Also, Twin Peaks is too insistent in locating the rot in the heart of the nuclear family to ever be nostalgic for that 50s American ideal. It's a show where the clean cut, fresh-faced popular crowd are the drug dealers and monsters, while the bikers for instance are sensitive and upright. That's also why all the kitschy Americana in the show (and Lynch's films) feels so surreal and fantastic: it's not an actual social ideal, so it holds no social or historical weight. Anyone who'd read Lynch's work as nostalgic or backward looking are badly misreading him.

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Re: Joe Dante

#193 Post by ford » Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:46 pm

Mr Sausage wrote:
Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:19 pm
Also, Twin Peaks is too insistent in locating the rot in the heart of the nuclear family to ever be nostalgic for that 50s American ideal. It's a show where the clean cut, fresh-faced popular crowd are the drug dealers and monsters, while the bikers for instance are sensitive and upright. That's also why all the kitschy Americana in the show (and Lynch's films) feels so surreal and fantastic: it's not an actual social ideal, so it holds no social or historical weight. Anyone who'd read Lynch's work as nostalgic or backward looking are badly misreading him.
Oh, I think he's definitely nostalgic for the early postwar era! No question about it. The music, films, etc were clearly of great inspiration to him, every bit as much as Francis Bacon. And, yes, the idea of Americana innocence under threat -- Twin Peaks season 3 is essentially a long rant about its total collapse. Ever seen that video where he drives around LA ranting about graffiti?

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#194 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:55 pm

I didn't read Twin Peaks: The Return that way at all- Lynch takes his time to stress that there's just as much 'good' in the modern world, and moments of humanity worth celebrating, as there was in the original run- maybe even moreso. Also, I don't think Dr. Amp's rant against mass consumerism and environmental ignorance, or Lynch himself championing LGBTQ+ rights, both with big Fuck Yous, are indicative of someone who wants to return to the good 'ol days when we were homogeneous consumers who ignored the environment and oppressed gay people. Yes, there's a hypocritical irony to Jacoby's bit ending with selling fake shovels, but I don't think the speech itself is that far off from one of Lynch's weather reports or whatever. And on a fundamental level of identity, he just embraces the 'weird' too much to pine for a time where everyone was expected to be conformist and not look for new ways to express esoteric ideas

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Re: Joe Dante

#195 Post by ford » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:10 pm

therewillbeblus wrote:
Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:55 pm
I didn't read Twin Peaks: The Return that way at all- Lynch takes his time to stress that there's just as much 'good' in the modern world, and moments of humanity worth celebrating, as there was in the original run- maybe even moreso. Also, I don't think Dr. Amp's rant against mass consumerism and environmental ignorance, or Lynch himself championing LGBTQ+ rights, both with big Fuck Yous, are indicative of someone who wants to return to the good 'ol days when we were homogeneous consumers who ignored the environment and oppressed gay people.
Maybe he's nostalgic for 35% labor union density rates (1954) and general lower levels of anomie and depression? Sounds good to me. One can be nostalgic for the good parts of an earlier social order -- even if it obscured a darker underbelly, which is what Lynch has depicted in BLUE VELVET as well as TWIN PEAKS -- while not holding any 'nostalgia' for the bad.

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Re: Joe Dante

#196 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:29 pm

I guess I'm even more confused by your initial post then. You seemed to reject my interpretation (of an episode you don't seem to have seen?) and then said who cares, because all that matters is that the thing is good or not. I was speaking to the intricacies of the episode, the bizarre nature of how aspects of the jokes were at odds with the show's playful nature, etc., but your response was dismissive in a call for binary merits. And now you're picking apart Lynch's intentions behind Twin Peaks and his own political ideas, arguing for something intricate and grey instead of the binary and simple declaration upthread. So is dissecting a work's expression of its politics only okay if you do it?

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Mr Sausage
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Re: Joe Dante

#197 Post by Mr Sausage » Wed Feb 01, 2023 7:29 pm

ford wrote:
Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:46 pm
Mr Sausage wrote:
Wed Feb 01, 2023 6:19 pm
Also, Twin Peaks is too insistent in locating the rot in the heart of the nuclear family to ever be nostalgic for that 50s American ideal. It's a show where the clean cut, fresh-faced popular crowd are the drug dealers and monsters, while the bikers for instance are sensitive and upright. That's also why all the kitschy Americana in the show (and Lynch's films) feels so surreal and fantastic: it's not an actual social ideal, so it holds no social or historical weight. Anyone who'd read Lynch's work as nostalgic or backward looking are badly misreading him.
Oh, I think he's definitely nostalgic for the early postwar era! No question about it. The music, films, etc were clearly of great inspiration to him, every bit as much as Francis Bacon. And, yes, the idea of Americana innocence under threat -- Twin Peaks season 3 is essentially a long rant about its total collapse. Ever seen that video where he drives around LA ranting about graffiti?
There is enormous question about it. The opening scene of Blue Velvet says it all: an impossibly magical 50s American landscape of happiness and innocence hiding horror and perversity right inside of it. Not being invade by it. Housing it, masking it, hiding it from view. A preppy, wholesome, babyfaced golden child discovering an abyss of sexual perversity latent inside him; a 50s beauty, all charm and grace, powerless to stop herself from enjoying her own abuse; a gang of sadists and criminals, all of whom are drenched in 50s culture, who exemplify it more than any other character to the point of being played by actors from that era. Or Twin Peaks, where the villains are not modernity but powerful men like fathers and Reagan-ite business men; where wholesome exteriors hide horrible secrets.

Not one single Lynch movie or tv series is set in the 1950s. His kitschy Americana is never granted any social weight--it's mainly iconography. If Lynch is nostalgic, he may well be nostalgic for the products of the 50s, like the music or the movies or the fashion. But he does not mistake that for a nostalgia for 50s American society. Hence how many of his movies locate evil within 50s Americana; how indifferent or outright critical they are towards central 50s institutions.

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Re: Joe Dante

#198 Post by joshua » Wed Feb 01, 2023 9:53 pm

I don't know about this reading therewillbeblus. I just watched No Brain, No Pain on youtube and I think the politics are exactly the kind of baby-boom era American liberalism Joe Dante has used all over his filmography. I think the jokes that you point out above are intended to read in a very different way than you took them. The first one, where the father is saying that he had heard rumors that the homeless man was the last living liberal in Eerie but did not believe he was an axe murderer, is, I think, playing off of the idea that liberalism was in retreat in Reagan's America like you said, but I think it is coming from a wounded liberal's sense of isolation more than it is from a conservative's triumphalism. I think the joke is there to set up the parents as dim-witted but well-meaning rubes who are go-along-get-along with the state of the world. They and their kind make the political reality of the country seem vast and all encompassing, but they did not create the situation. The scientist's wife, on the other hand, is an active agent for the way the country has turned out. In the past she had made a deal with Ed Meese to use her husband's brain machine to throw the 1980 election in Reagan's favor by increasing his intellect four fold (the joke being that he was so stupid even his closest campaign associate knew he couldn't win on his own merits). Besides being an opportunist, she’s also presented as a true believer in the cause. In the scene where she is in disguise, asking passersby for help finding the homeless man, she hisses "Democrats" after walking away from a black couple who couldn't help her. She's obviously the villain. The main character kid might not know what a liberal is (or for that matter that he is one), but he does know the golden rule and its corollary and his sense of empathy will prove to be pivotal by the end. We also learn later that the scientist is basically a good guy who says that he invents stuff for the benefit of all of humanity. So between these sides, one of unquestioned comfort (parents) created by greed and deception (the scientist's wife) versus a just (the main character) and egalitarian progress (the scientist) lies the story of the grey-haired kid who is the real center of the story. It is what he chooses that shows where the perspective of the story is coming from. Oh and also the jokes are all, in my opinion, pointed at the right.

The most obvious ones are:
SpoilerShow
- The Reagan-being-so-stupid-he-needed-Macgyver-levels-of-help-to-win-an-election joke.

- When the scientist is in Simon-the-sidekick's body he asks who the current president is. Marshall says that it's George Bush and the VP is Dan Quayle. Simon slaps his forehead and say, "This is worse than I imagined!"

- When the grey haired kid is holding the 8-track with Simon on it as leverage, he starts pulling out the tape and says, "One false move and Simon here becomes vice presidential" obviously refering to how dumb Quayle is.

- The scientist's wife saying near the end, "No brains, no witnesses. The boys at the committee to re-elect taught me that one." It shows she was an apparatchik of the Reagan/Bush years.

- There is also the one where the sister is watching daytime TV and the homeless man/scientist looks over at her and says, "Did they steal your brain too?"

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therewillbeblus
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Re: Joe Dante

#199 Post by therewillbeblus » Wed Feb 01, 2023 11:26 pm

Interesting take, joshua! I felt like I acclimated to the style of the show and what its doing enough across the course of a condensed binge to discern that this episode didn't gel with the typical satirical delivery- both my partner and I had the same reaction and we typically default to assuming satire in these cases. However, the series’ tone (established by Dante, though he’s not involved in this particular episode) absolutely falls more in line with your reading, which is partly why it seemed so strange! I didn’t even consider that interpretation of the Reagan joke, but again, your reading makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the detailed response, I appreciate the pushback and I'll have to revisit it again in the future as an isolated episode to see if it plays differently

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Re: Joe Dante

#200 Post by therewillbeblus » Thu Feb 02, 2023 1:20 am

Finished the series tonight, and had a blast with "Reality Takes a Holiday," which is an extremely clever way to end a show preemptively canceled. The meta-stuff mostly works, even on levels unintended - I love the bit where Marshall accuses Dash of being the real reason why they're getting canceled, considering Marsden is a grating presence, was brought on to revise the show's dynamics and obviously failed to yield the result anticipated - though I doubt the writing was deliberately as meanspirited towards a child actor as it sounds! The implicit pathos of Omri's displacement (here referred to by actor name from the other characters) from the artificial familiar into a pre-Truman Show web of fatalism (literally, he's supposed to be assassinated!) is very effective at projecting a more subtle yet powerful message: That the egocentric fantasies kids concoct and live in are invaluable safe spaces, used to cope with the overwhelming stimuli in the 'real world' that they cannot grasp, and that, when intruded upon or when they naturally wear off as a child approaches a new season of life, sober to a new developmental stage, there's a loss felt and a period of destabilization that occurs (now that's a familiar Dante trope!) For Marshall, the character living in the show that's ending, that might now look like acclimating to Eerie and outgrowing a preoccupation with nonconformist spying into the occult, by doing banal things like going to the movies with his family. For Omri, that might look like an uncertain future as a child star. Either way, we are given a front-row seat, with Demme-ish camera angles looking Omri directly in the face (only giving off the vibe of a suffocating gaze rather than Demme's confrontationally-humanistic engagement) to watch Omri and Marshall go through something challenging, and profoundly relatable for anyone who remembers what living and moving through these inherently egocentric stages was like. It's fascinating stuff, but it's also kind of documenting trauma, ironically bookending a show about fake traumas with real ones.

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