Hong Kong Cinema

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cowboydan
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2020 1:27 pm

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#376 Post by cowboydan » Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:43 pm


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DeprongMori
Joined: Fri Apr 04, 2014 1:59 am
Location: San Francisco

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#377 Post by DeprongMori » Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:13 am

So, what’s the longest anyone has had to wait for a delivery from Hong Kong Rescue? I’ve only ordered once before, and I think it was delivered in about 2-3 months (no pre-orders),

This time it will be five months next week — again, no pre-orders — and no delivery and no response to email queries to either his personal email or the support email. Although I’m not in a rush, five months with no response seems a bit extreme. As I was happy with the results of the first two titles I ordered, this time I ordered four. Probably a mistake.

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feihong
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:20 pm

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#378 Post by feihong » Thu Sep 23, 2021 2:20 am

All the e-mails the guy has sent in the last 6 months have mentioned shortages of materials he uses, like the cases for the discs. The last few messages have been about making discs and shipping them, so something is probably moving, and I imagine that might have been the reason for the longer-than-usual delay.

I have not received The Killer, and I was on it right when it debuted. Luckily, the download option proved to be pretty helpful there. But in terms of the delay, I think that's a pretty common experience right now.

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Adam X
Joined: Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:04 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#379 Post by Adam X » Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:53 am

I placed a similar order at the start of May with the same result. Recently sent a second email asking after my order, but as feihong said, I imagine he’ll get to them eventually. This is the problem when it’s essentially one person doing everything on the production end. I’m guessing the postal situation was in no way aided by finally releasing The Killer while (or just before?) he had supply issues.

Hopefully all backorders get dealt with before too long.

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The Elegant Dandy Fop
Joined: Thu Dec 09, 2004 3:25 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#380 Post by The Elegant Dandy Fop » Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:15 am

Adam X wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 6:53 am
Recently sent a second email asking after my order, but as feihong said, I imagine he’ll get to them eventually
He will never respond to your e-mail. I’ve sent upwards of five e-mails to this guy with zero response.

I know sharing movies here, even ones out of circulation, is a big no-no here, but I wonder why supporting this bootlegger is okay? Most of the films he continues to sell have been issued elsewhere at this point. I understand they have more special features, but he’s still selling films he doesn’t own. Considering that he’s selling BD-Rs at $16 and needs to order cases by the thousands, he’s collecting a handsome profit while not being able to fulfill any orders on time. Seeing as his personal information is all over his e-mails, I’m surprised Fortune Star hasn’t come down on him yet.

pistolwink
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:07 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#381 Post by pistolwink » Fri Sep 24, 2021 3:30 pm

If you file a complaint w/ PayPal you will probably either get your money back (if he doesn't respond) or light a fire under his butt so he actually sends you what you ordered.

But, yeah, I've had it w/ this dude.

cowboydan
Joined: Sat Apr 18, 2020 1:27 pm

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#382 Post by cowboydan » Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:02 pm

Don't give up hope. I ordered 2 copies of the Killer in May, and I just got the shipping confirmation today.

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feihong
Joined: Thu Nov 04, 2004 12:20 pm

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#383 Post by feihong » Sat Sep 25, 2021 2:04 am

I've waited longer intervals when I've purchased items from official sources. My French DVD of Shadows of Forgotten Ancestors took almost 9 months to ship to me back in the day.

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Lemmy Caution
Joined: Wed Mar 29, 2006 3:26 am
Location: East of Shanghai

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#384 Post by Lemmy Caution » Tue Sep 28, 2021 3:55 pm

cowboydan wrote:
Wed Sep 22, 2021 11:43 pm
https://hongkongfp.com/2021/09/22/iron- ... mand-cuts/

The censoring has begun.
More.

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yoloswegmaster
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 3:57 pm

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#385 Post by yoloswegmaster » Tue Oct 26, 2021 9:31 am

Irongod has confirmed that Yes Madam, Royal Warriors & Magnificent Warriors are receiving restorations by Fortune Star, so we possibly could see a Michelle Yeoh set if Eureka decides to grab them.

WmS
Joined: Mon Nov 30, 2015 9:46 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#386 Post by WmS » Sat Oct 30, 2021 3:12 am

The Elegant Dandy Fop wrote:
Fri Sep 24, 2021 10:15 am
I know sharing movies here, even ones out of circulation, is a big no-no here, but I wonder why supporting this bootlegger is okay? Most of the films he continues to sell have been issued elsewhere at this point.
I also do not understand this, considering how scrupulously this board's members speak only of "backchannels."

I'll add that I made the mistake of sending him money but I got it back.

You only have 180 days after your payment date to open a dispute with Paypal. I sent PDFs of every email he never responded to, contacted him again, CC'd his other email address I found, no response. Paypal sets it up so you're supposed to work it out with the seller, and only then do you escalate it to them. I did after a few days. They contact him, he ignores that too, ten days later case closed. Please do not wait past six months to see if maybe he'll send you the blu-rays. He won't. Please just get your money back.

The most charitable reading is that this bootlegger got overwhelmed and will honestly get around to everyone's order when he finally can. He's very busy, doing his best! But the only visible thing the guy's done in the last six months is put a "support" tab on his web site so you can send him up to $100 a month so he can put more time into rescuing Hong Kong, he says.

I hope everyone else who ordered from this guy gets your money back, and I kindly request people here stop carrying water for this guy.

***

Royal Warriors and Yes Madam rule. Yes Madam's final fight is an all-timer, the ending's shocking, Tsui Hark puts in a fine turn. I'm very excited to see Prodigal Son in HD, as it has two of the best fights ever filmed. I hope Eureka goes for some other Sammo from that era, in particular The Victim (Beardy!) and Knockabout, which is I think the best physical performance Yuen Biao ever put in. I never thought any of these movies would get legitimate blu-ray releases and it's been a pleasure to see so many get resurrected in such fine editions.

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Maltic
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2020 1:36 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#387 Post by Maltic » Sat Oct 30, 2021 8:21 am

I'm reminded of that Woody Allen quip (food is terrible there, and such small portions).

That's not to say I don't share those contradictory sentiments. I have considered ordering HKR's stuff and the fact that I didn't in end probably has as much to do with the hassle as with me taking a moral stand against bootlegging.

pistolwink
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:07 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#388 Post by pistolwink » Sat Nov 13, 2021 5:02 pm

In thinking about the OUATIC box sets, I reflected on how long it took for Tsui Hark's films to enter the institutional canon of cinephilia. Obviously there have been big fans of his films all over the world for a long while, but it was definitely a niche taste among cinephiles — as witness the fact that none of his films (and pratically no HK genre films at all, save for a couple King Hus and one or two Jackie Chans; Wong Kar-wai doesn't really count IMO) were on that enormous Sight & Sound poll in 2012.

And this recognition is coming at a time when Tsui's newer films—and the ones he has lined up—are particularly dispiriting, in part because of the seeming decline of his talents but mostly because of what's happened to HK cinema in general under the Xi -era centralization of Chinese culture.

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colinr0380
Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 4:30 pm
Location: Chapel-en-le-Frith, Derbyshire, UK

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#389 Post by colinr0380 » Sun Nov 14, 2021 8:32 am

I'm taking this (certainly welcome) sudden resurgence of Hong Kong cinema as every label scrambling to prioritise getting what they can out whilst they are able to (and/or supporting the unique legacy of Hong Kong in general)

Orlac
Joined: Tue Apr 14, 2009 4:29 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#390 Post by Orlac » Sun Nov 14, 2021 1:36 pm

Eureka's Joseph Kuo set comes very reccomended!

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yoloswegmaster
Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2016 3:57 pm

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#391 Post by yoloswegmaster » Tue Dec 21, 2021 3:25 pm

Koch Media will be releasing Infernal Affairs on 4K UHD in Germany.

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The Fanciful Norwegian
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:24 pm
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Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#392 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Mon Jan 24, 2022 5:40 pm

Not sure where else to put this—I thought of making a thread in the Lists subforum where I could put all of the interesting lists I find on the Chinese-language web, but that section's for user lists. So this thread seems like the best alternative.

A big caveat: I found this on social media and no source was given. However, all of these directors contributed ballots for the "Best 100 Chinese Motion Pictures" list put together by the Hong Kong Film Awards in 2005, and no films later than 2004 appear here, so that's almost certainly where these came from. Other directors invited to contribute were Bryan Chang, Cheuk Ang-tong, Alfred Cheung, Cheung Chi-sing, Joe Cheung, Samson Chiu, Allan Fung, Allen Fong (yes, those are two different people), Alex Law, Joe Ma, Ng See-yuen, Patrick Tam, Terry Tong, Wai Ka-fai, Wong Tin-lam, and Peter Yung. Maybe they didn't submit their lists, and some may have been excluded by the social media poster because they're not primarily known as directors.

I'm also at a loss to determine what if any order these lists are in. Some are mostly chronological but with inexplicable exceptions; some seem to have groupings (notably Tsui Hark's); others are in an arbitrary order that suggests an actual ranking. But don't assume that just because a film is at #1 on somebody's list that it's their #1 Chinese-language film of all time.

Fruit Chan
  1. The Big Road (1934, Sun Yu)
  2. Street Angel (1937, Yuan Muzhi)
  3. Spring in a Small Town (1948, Fei Mu)
  4. Liu Sanjie (1960, Su Li)
  5. A Touch of Zen (1970/1971, King Hu)
  6. The Butterfly Murders (1979, Tsui Hark)
  7. The Secret (1979, Ann Hui)
  8. Yellow Earth (1984, Chen Kaige)
  9. The Time to Live and the Time to Die (1985, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  10. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  11. Red Sorghum (1987, Zhang Yimou)
  12. A City of Sadness (1989, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  13. Days of Being Wild (1990, Wong Kar-wai)
  14. A Brighter Summer Day (1991, Edward Yang)
  15. Center Stage (1991, Stanley Kwan)
  16. Farewell My Concubine (1993, Chen Kaige)
  17. Comrades: Almost a Love Story (1996, Peter Ho-sun Chan)
  18. Made in Hong Kong (1997, Fruit Chan)
  19. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (2000, Ang Lee)
  20. Durian Durian (2000, Fruit Chan)
Gordon Chan
  1. A City of Sadness (1989, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  2. Be My Love (1968, Chor Yuen)
  3. The Time to Live and the Time to Die (1985, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  4. Center Stage (1991, Stanley Kwan)
  5. Days of Being Wild (1990, Wong Kar-wai)
  6. Police Story (1985, Jackie Chan)
  7. My Intimate Partner (1960, Chun Kim)
  8. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  9. Comrades: Almost a Love Story (1996, Peter Ho-sun Chan)
  10. Fist of Fury (1972, Lo Wei)
  11. The Winter (1969, Li Han-hsiang)
  12. Man on the Brink (1981, Alex Cheung)
  13. An Autumn's Tale (1987, Mabel Cheung)
  14. Old Well (1986, Wu Tianming)
  15. The Secret (1979, Ann Hui)
  16. A Chinese Odyssey (1995, Jeffrey Lau)
  17. Once Upon a Time in China (1991, Tsui Hark)
  18. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  19. Yellow Earth (1984, Chen Kaige)
Peter Ho-sun Chan
  1. In the Heat of the Sun (1994, Jiang Wen)
  2. Durian Durian (2000, Fruit Chan)
  3. Street Angel (1937, Yuan Muzhi)
  4. In the Face of Demolition (1953, Lee Tit)
  5. Myriad of Lights (1948, Shen Fu)
  6. Spring in a Small Town (1948, Fei Mu)
  7. Song of the Fishermen (1934, Cai Chusheng)
  8. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  9. The Winter (1969, Li Han-hsiang)
  10. Pushing Hands (1991, Ang Lee)
  11. The Story of Qiu Ju (1992, Zhang Yimou)
  12. City on Fire (1987, Ringo Lam)
  13. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  14. Father and Son (1981, Allen Fong)
  15. Infernal Affairs (2002, Andrew Lau and Alan Mak)
  16. In the Mood for Love (2001, Wong Kar-wai)
  17. Farewell My Concubine (1993, Chen Kaige)
  18. Once Upon a Time in China II (1992, Tsui Hark)
  19. My Intimate Partner (1960, Chun Kim)
Ann Hui
  1. Spring in a Small Town (1948, Fei Mu)
  2. Early Spring (1963, Xie Tieli)
  3. Street Angel (1937, Yuan Muzhi)
  4. Yellow Earth (1984, Chen Kaige)
  5. The Time to Live and the Time to Die (1985, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  6. The Terrorizers (1986, Edward Yang)
  7. The Spring River Flows East (1947, Cai Chusheng and Zheng Junli)
  8. Ah Ying (1983, Allen Fong)
  9. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (2000, Ang Lee)
  10. The Wedding Banquet (1993, Ang Lee)
  11. Days of Being Wild (1990, Wong Kar-wai)
  12. Homecoming (1984, Yim Ho)
  13. Swordsman II (1992, Ching Siu-tung)
  14. Two Stage Sisters (1964, Xie Jin)
  15. Vive l'amour (1994, Tsai Ming-liang)
  16. Infernal Affairs (2002, Andrew Lau and Alan Mak)
  17. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  18. Rouge (1988, Stanley Kwan
  19. The Story of Qiu Ju (1992, Zhang Yimou)
  20. A City of Sadness (1989, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
Stanley Kwan
  1. Spring in a Small Town (1948, Fei Mu)
  2. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  3. A Touch of Zen (1970/1971, King Hu)
  4. The Arch (1968, Tang Shu-shuen)
  5. The Private Eyes (1976, Michael Hui)
  6. Long Arm of the Law (1984, Johnny Mak)
  7. Yellow Earth (1984, Chen Kaige)
  8. The Time to Live and the Time to Die (1985, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  9. Center Stage (1991, Stanley Kwan)
  10. A Brighter Summer Day (1991, Edward Yang)
  11. In the Heat of the Sun (1994, Jiang Wen)
  12. Ashes of Time (1994, Wong Kar-wai)
  13. Xiao Wu (1997, Jia Zhangke)
  14. A City of Sadness (1989, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  15. Dangerous Encounter - 1st Kind (1980, Tsui Hark)
  16. Days of Being Wild (1990, Wong Kar-wai)
  17. Swan Song (1985, Zhang Zeming)
  18. Rouge (1988, Stanley Kwan)
  19. Taipei Story (1985, Edward Yang)
  20. The Secret (1979, Ann Hui)
Tsui Hark
  1. Dingjun Mountain (1905, Ren Qingtai)
  2. Havoc in Heaven (1961/1964, Wan Laiming)
  3. The Love Eterne (1963, Li Han-hsiang)
  4. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  5. One-Armed Swordsman (1967, Chang Cheh)
  6. The Bride and I (1969, Pai Ching-jui)
  7. Jumping Ash (1976, Po-Chih Leong and Josephine Siao)
  8. The Private Eyes (1976, Michael Hui)
  9. The Boys from Fengkuei (1983, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  10. A Brighter Summer Day (1991, Edward Yang)
  11. Yellow Earth (1984, Chen Kaige)
  12. Red Sorghum (1987, Zhang Yimou)
  13. Shaolin Temple (1982, Chang Hsin-yen)
  14. Long Arm of the Law (1984, Johnny Mak)
  15. The Story of a Discharged Prisoner (1967, Patrick Lung Kong)
  16. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  17. Chungking Express (1994, Wong Kar-wai)
  18. Prison on Fire (1987, Ringo Lam)
  19. The Wedding Banquet (1993, Ang Lee)
  20. Shaolin Soccer (2001, Stephen Chow)
Wong Jing
  1. The Spring River Flows East (1947, Cai Chusheng and Zheng Junli)
  2. Sorrows of the Forbidden City (1948, Zhu Shilin)
  3. The Wild, Wild Rose (1960, Wong Tin-lam)
  4. The Love Eterne (1963, Li Han-hsiang)
  5. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  6. The Story of a Discharged Prisoner (1967, Patrick Lung Kong)
  7. Fist of Fury (1972, Lo Wei)
  8. Drunken Master (1978, Yuen Woo-ping)
  9. Long Arm of the Law (1984, Johnny Mak)
  10. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  11. At Dawn (1967, Sung Tsun-shou)
  12. In the Heat of the Sun (1994, Jiang Wen)
  13. God of Gamblers (1989, Wong Jing)
  14. The Wedding Banquet (1993, Ang Lee)
  15. Chungking Express (1994, Wong Kar-wai)
  16. Expect the Unexpected (1998, Patrick Yau)
  17. Shaolin Soccer (2001, Stephen Chow)
  18. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (2000, Ang Lee)
  19. In the Mood for Love (2001, Wong Kar-wai)
  20. Infernal Affairs (2002, Andrew Lau and Alan Mak)
Wong Kar-wai
  1. The Goddess (1934, Wu Yonggang)
  2. Song at Midnight (1937, Ma-Xu Weibang)
  3. The Spring River Flows East (1947, Cai Chusheng and Zheng Junli)
  4. Spring in a Small Town (1948, Fei Mu)
  5. Sorrows of the Forbidden City (1948, Zhu Shilin)
  6. The Legend of Purple Hairpin (1959, Lee Tit)
  7. The Red Detachment of Women (1960, Xie Jin)
  8. Early Spring (1963, Xie Tieli)
  9. The Love Eterne (1963, Li Han-hsiang)
  10. Havoc in Heaven (1961/1964, Wan Laiming)
  11. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  12. Yellow Earth (1984, Chen Kaige)
  13. Long Arm of the Law (1984, Johnny Mak)
  14. Shanghai Blues (1984, Tsui Hark)
  15. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  16. A City of Sadness (1989, Hou Hsiao-hsien)
  17. A Brighter Summer Day (1991, Edward Yang)
  18. The Story of Qiu Ju (1992, Zhang Yimou)
  19. In the Heat of the Sun (1994, Jiang Wen)
  20. The Blood Brothers (1973, Chang Cheh)
Yim Ho
  1. Crossroads (1937, Shen Xiling)
  2. Song at Midnight (1937, Ma-Xu Weibang)
  3. Street Angel (1937, Yuan Muzhi)
  4. This Life of Mine (1950, Shui Hui)
  5. The Opuim Wars (1959, Zheng Junli and Cen Fan)
  6. The Lin Family Shop (1959, Shui Hua)
  7. The Naval Battle of 1894 (1962, Nong Lin)
  8. The House of 72 Tenants (1973, Chor Yuen)
  9. One-Armed Swordsman (1967, Chang Cheh)
  10. A Touch of Zen (1970/1971, King Hu)
  11. The Private Eyes (1976, Michael Hui)
  12. Boat People (1982, Ann Hui)
  13. Homecoming (1984, Yim Ho)
  14. A Better Tomorrow (1986, John Woo)
  15. The Day the Sun Turned Cold (1994, Yim Ho)
  16. A Chinese Ghost Story (1987, Ching Siu-tung)
  17. As Tears Go By (1988, Wong Kar-wai)
  18. Farewell My Concubine (1993, Chen Kaige)
  19. The Wedding Banquet (1993, Ang Lee)
  20. Comrades: Almost a Love Story (1996, Peter Ho-sun Chan)
Yonfan
  1. Spring in a Small Town (1948, Fei Mu)
  2. Long Live the Missus! (1947, Sang Hu)
  3. The Spring River Flows East (1947, Cai Chusheng and Zheng Junli)
  4. Princess Cheung Ping (1959, Tso Kea)
  5. The Kingdom and the Beauty (1959, Li Han-hsiang)
  6. Love Without End (1961, Doe Ching)
  7. Dragon Inn (1967, King Hu)
  8. Boat People (1982, Ann Hui)
  9. Made in Hong Kong (1997, Fruit Chan)
  10. Days of Being Wild (1990, Wong Kar-wai)
  11. The Secret (1979, Ann Hui)
  12. Durian Durian (2000, Fruit Chan)
  13. 2046 (2004, Wong Kar-wai)
  14. Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon (2000, Ang Lee)
  15. Passion (1986, Sylvia Chang)
  16. 20 30 40 (2004, Sylvia Chang)
Some stray comments:
  • Genuinely surprised how many directors voted for their own films—granted it's not much of a shock from Wong Jing, but I didn't expect Stanley Kwan and Yim Ho would do it twice!
  • The first movie on Tsui's list is a lost film that may not have actually existed. There's no record of it before a 1938 article based on anonymous hearsay (and that didn't even give the name of the film or the year of production), the two people who claimed to have witnessed the shooting are only recorded as saying so decades later and contradicted each other on key details, and the two supposed stills of the film were originally published in 1932 with no mention of an associated movie. If the film was made it was probably later than 1905.
  • Films on five or more ballots: A Better Tomorrow (8), Spring in a Small Town/Dragon Inn (7), Yellow Earth (6), A City of Sadness/Days of Being Wild (5). These ranked 2nd, 1st, 7th, 4th, 5th, and 3rd on the final list, respectively.
  • The absence of Kung Fu Hustle gives us an idea of when the ballots were drawn up: the only 2004 films here (2046 and 20 30 40, its sequel set in the 2,031st century) opened in Hong Kong in September and March, but Kung Fu Hustle didn't open until Christmas Eve.

pistolwink
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:07 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#393 Post by pistolwink » Mon Jan 24, 2022 9:29 pm

Thanks for this!

There are a handful of 50s/60s HK (and one Taiwan) films here that aren't widely available (unless they are known to me under different titles, which is quite possible):

In the Face of Demolition (1953, Lee Tit) (I have read a bit about this one, but have never been able to see it)
The Legend of Purple Hairpin (1959, Lee Tit)
Princess Cheung Ping (1959, Tso Kea)
My Intimate Partner (1960, Chun Kim)
At Dawn (1967, Sung Tsun-shou)
Be My Love (1968, Chor Yuen)
The Winter (1969, Li Han-hsiang)
The Bride and I (1969, Pai Ching-jui)

I'm going to guess some of these, including definitely In the Face of Demolition, are among the "socially critical" or Left-ish melodramas that HK film critics championed for many years (often over the genre/action cinema we now associate w/ the territory).


Also— I think Tsui Hark re-made half of the films on his list! :D

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The Fanciful Norwegian
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:24 pm
Location: Teegeeack

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#394 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Mon Jan 24, 2022 10:52 pm

Really In the Face of Demolition is the only one that fits that genre. The other Lee Tit movie is an opera film, as is Princess Cheung Ping (which was later remade by John Woo). My Intimate Partner is apparently a buddy comedy and Be My Love is a romance with Patrick Tse and Josephine Siao. The remaining three are Taiwanese films, two produced by Li Han-hsiang after he left Hong Kong over a contract dispute with Shaw Brothers: At Dawn sounds like a legal thriller set during the Qing Dynasty and The Winter a melodrama in modern Taipei (a lot of sources say it's Northern China, but I think that's some sort of translation error). The Bride and I is a contemporary marital comedy produced by the Central Motion Picture Corporation, but doesn't look to be among the many titles they've restored.

The Legend of Purple Hairpin and My Intimate Partner have DVDs in Hong Kong with no English subtitles, which is unfortunately the norm for pre-1970s Cantonese movies. The long-OOP HK VCD of In the Face of Demolition might have them, but my only source for that is a secondhand listing on a Singaporean eBay-type site. There's an unsubtitled Taiwanese DVD of The Bride and I and while I won't directly link them here, a certain popular streaming-video site has subtitled copies of At Dawn and The Winter listed under their original Chinese titles. Princess Cheung Ping doesn't have a DVD that I can find, but there's a copy with Chinese subtitles online and the John Woo version got an English-subbed release using the Mandarin romanization Princess Changping. I haven't seen any of these so I can't vouch for whether it's worth the effort to watch them.

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Maltic
Joined: Sat Oct 10, 2020 1:36 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#395 Post by Maltic » Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:57 am

I wonder if any them would think twice about making a "One China" list today (Tsui Hark, for one, probably wouldn't).

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The Fanciful Norwegian
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Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#396 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Tue Jan 25, 2022 2:13 pm

That's more an issue with the ambiguity of the word "Chinese" in English; the original title of the list literally translates to "100 Best Chinese-Language Movies," using a word for "Chinese-language" (華語 Huayu) that refers to ethnicity rather than a state. I don't get the impression the usage is particularly controversial even in Taiwan, where the main film awards (the Golden Horse Awards) are for Huayu films and the top prize once went to Ilo Ilo from Singapore, which has never been considered a Chinese state. But with China in an increasingly hardline mood it's getting a lot harder to organize film events on the basis of Huayu—no commercial productions from the China (including Hong Kong) have been submitted to the Golden Horse Awards since 2018, when one of the winners gave a speech advocating Taiwan independence, and the UK's Chinese Visual Festival is likely finished after last year's installment, when two "aboveground" Chinese films (Back to the Wharf and Spring Tide) were withdrawn, probably because the festival's marketing materials included references to the Taiwanese Ministry of Culture.

As a sort of aside, in 2011 the Golden Horse Awards published their own list of the 100 greatest Chinese-language films, from ballots submitted by 122 filmmakers, critics, scholars, and artists. The jurors were primarily Taiwanese much as the HKFA jurors were primarily Hongkongers, and that's naturally reflected in the results—the Golden Horse list has no pre-1970s Cantonese movies, much more Hou, Yang, Tsai, etc. You can see a list of the jurors (in Chinese) here, but unfortunately the Wayback Machine didn't save the individual ballots. Luckily the festival published a very nice commemorative volume in Chinese and English that includes all of the ballots, plus essays on each film. I have a copy on my way and I'll definitely share the ballots from some of the more familiar names, though not in this thread.

pistolwink
Joined: Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:07 am

Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#397 Post by pistolwink » Thu Jan 27, 2022 8:57 am

Right, those 50s/60s films reflect what people like Tsui, Hui, etc. were seeing in their youth in HK and elsewhere in the Chinese diaspora. Would those Cantonese films made in HK in that era have received any distribution in Taiwan at all, for the Cantonese-speaking minority?

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The Fanciful Norwegian
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Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#398 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Mon Feb 14, 2022 5:20 pm

pistolwink wrote:
Thu Jan 27, 2022 8:57 am
Right, those 50s/60s films reflect what people like Tsui, Hui, etc. were seeing in their youth in HK and elsewhere in the Chinese diaspora. Would those Cantonese films made in HK in that era have received any distribution in Taiwan at all, for the Cantonese-speaking minority?
Sorry I missed this. As far as I've been able to tell, no Cantonese films were released in Taiwan during this period, and a lot of them (including In the Face of Demolition) would've been banned due to the left-wing affiliations of the studios and personnel involved. Additionally, the Cantonese-speaking audience in Taiwan was negligible and subtitling wasn't commonly done at this point, which also posed a problem for Mandarin films, albeit a lesser one since most of the post-1945 arrivals from the mainland were Mandarin speakers. Some HK Cantonese films were released in Taiwan during the civil war period and the immediate aftermath, but purely as a temporary way to plug the gap caused by the end of new product from the mainland and the banning of older mainland films from filmmakers who had sided with the Communists. To make these films accessible to the overwhelmingly non-Cantonese-speaking audience, Taiwanese-speaking benshi were used, as they had been during the Japanese era.

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Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#399 Post by pistolwink » Tue Feb 15, 2022 8:33 am

Thanks for the informative response! I don't know why it hadn't before occurred to me that benshi would have been a tradition in Taiwan given the Japanese influence.

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Re: Hong Kong Cinema: A Guide

#400 Post by The Fanciful Norwegian » Tue Feb 15, 2022 1:46 pm

The use of benshi (pian-su in Taiwanese) seems to have outlasted Japanese rule by a good while—the government banned Taiwanese-language interpretation of Mandarin films in 1959, implying it was still going on at that point. A Borrowed Life has a memorable scene with a benshi that takes place shortly after the war. Supposedly Cathay/MP&GI was the first to put subtitles on Mandarin films, at the request of Taiwan's Union Film Company (which started out as a distributor/exhibitor of Mandarin imports before moving into production with Dragon Inn). I don't know when that was, though in Hong Kong at least it was still common in the early '60s for Mandarin films to go out without subtitles, except maybe for song sequences.

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