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Considering that one of the alternatives was It's A Mad Mad World (also a Criterion title) and that I wanted Manchurian Candidate, I'm not exactly unhappy with today's announcement. Feedback on their recent MGM 4ks like The Great Escape has been good, for Some Like It Hot even excellent. Last not least, $17.99 during a Kino sale against $24.99 or more during a Criterion sale if they'd been doing the UHD instead. The only disappointment could be Kino saying they won't be doing an HDR pass on it.

captveg wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 6:41 pm The market has also changed in the last two years. Criterion didn't think anything was worth releasing on 4K UHD if we are to go by what labels thought two years ago.

Yes, UHD numbers are much better now, but rumor is that Criterion was ready to start UHDs but held back because of the pandemic.

Also, I have a hard time buying that Touch of Evil is such a better seller than Double Indemnity that it was ripe for a UHD announcement a year or two back but Double Indemnity wasn't. (Kino is up to how many announced with no release date UHD titles now? 25 or 30.)

Finch wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 8:05 pm The only disappointment could be Kino saying they won't be doing an HDR pass on it.

Their announcement for Manchurian Candidate says "brand new Dolby Vision HDR master" for what it's worth, though you may have meant a different title or Kino UHD's in general, which have been inconsistent in that area.

Why do people put so much credence into what Kino says or does when they have discredited themselves time and again through their representatives in public forums to the point that when they were caught lying their tactic was to insult their customers.
Some people with insights to the label can correct me, but I have never seen any “strategy” behind their releases other than throwing anything they can get their hands on at a wall to see what sticks. They publish everything from hardly seen silent movies to documentaries to renowned Hollywood classics to c movies nobody remembered - and for good reasons. And many times the transfers are sub-par or mediocre and often have been bested by other labels. Yes there has been the occasional gem and one can argue better to have a movie on disc even in suboptimal form than not at all, but for me every time I see a movie I like released by Kino, I’m cringing and thinking another missed opportunity of doing the film justice and having it published instead by a label that cares.

As to the Criterions it feels to me they tried to get their hands on as many titles as they could at a time when Criterion was reluctant to commit, as their hope is that publishing a former Criterion title in UHD will provide it with better chances for a decent sale by the same people who previously bought the Criterion release.

And from what I can tell their UHD track record hasn’t been stellar either so far.

My opinion still hasn’t changed about Kino, and given that I have limited funds and can’t buy everything I want, I’d rather spend my money on labels where I can expect a great edition most of the time even if that means I miss out on an occasional good release from Kino. There are only so many hours in a day to watch movies.

dwk wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 8:37 pm

captveg wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 6:41 pm The market has also changed in the last two years. Criterion didn't think anything was worth releasing on 4K UHD if we are to go by what labels thought two years ago.

Yes, UHD numbers are much better now, but rumor is that Criterion was ready to start UHDs but held back because of the pandemic.

Also, I have a hard time buying that Touch of Evil is such a better seller than Double Indemnity that it was ripe for a UHD announcement a year or two back but Double Indemnity wasn't. (Kino is up to how many announced with no release date UHD titles now? 25 or 30.)

Also gotta consider that Kino were able to secure many more titles from MGM than from Universal, so had to be a little pickier with their Universal titles. The only older catalog title they got from Universal was Touch of Evil, so in that context if they were picking just one 40s/50s title they saw Touch of Evil as a better bet for them.

As for announced UHD titles without a release date, it's currently 13 (14 once their final MGM title form the current deal is announced "next Sunday"). Mostly the Universal titles have had the delays, seemingly pandemic related.

They have to buy blocks of titles from some studios where in return for Films A, B, C which they really want, they also have to agree to release X, Y, and Z. They have some control over the mandatory titles (I think they’re literally given a list to pick from), but it does explain some of their oddball choices— though we’ve probably been the beneficiary more than the victim due to this!

bad future wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 9:01 pm

Finch wrote: Mon Feb 21, 2022 8:05 pm The only disappointment could be Kino saying they won't be doing an HDR pass on it.

Their announcement for Manchurian Candidate says "brand new Dolby Vision HDR master" for what it's worth, though you may have meant a different title or Kino UHD's in general, which have been inconsistent in that area.

Bad phrasing on my part, actually. Since I couldn't remember which other title wasn't supposed to be in HDR, I meant to say the only disappointment would be if Kino were to say that Manchurian Candidate is not getting an HDR grade.

The other upside I see from Kino putting some Criterion BD titles out in 4k first is that, provided they don't fuck up the encode or other aspects of video and audio (never mind that Criterion's own 4k QC has been a bit of a howler too), it frees Criterion up to do something else in 4k (The Leopard would be most welcome, for example) instead of something as unfunny as Some Like It Hot. Kino getting there first for a specific license is only really annoying if they can't be arsed to fix whatever flaws are either baked into the master provided (color space on Lambs, missing audio on Body Snatchers) or they give the encoding duties to someone that couldn't organise a piss up in the brewery (Body Snatchers) (all three of which we know Criterion would have fixed retrospectively or gotten right in the first place re 4k encoding). To their credit, they fixed Hard Target and hopefully the streak of solid MGM-licensed releases continues so that perhaps none of us will have to feel like a Kino pre-order is a gamble in the future.

Finch wrote: Tue Feb 22, 2022 12:23 am Kino getting there first for a specific license is only really annoying if they can't be arsed to fix whatever flaws are either baked into the master provided (color space on Lambs, missing audio on Body Snatchers)

I assume you mean "Spaceballs"? I don't recall any reports of missing audio on Body Snatchers.

I think there is a line missing on Body Snatchers, and the Arrow Blu is the only one that bothered to restore it.

From what I gather, the UHD has the same problem that afflicted MGM’s original BD, which is that Don Siegel’s taxi driver reacts to his radio, but we don’t hear it - and we should be able to hear it.

Arrow fixed this in their BD, but as far as I’m aware that’s the only high-definition release that did.

MichaelB wrote: Tue Feb 22, 2022 6:14 am From what I gather, the UHD has the same problem that afflicted MGM’s original BD, which is that Don Siegel’s taxi driver reacts to his radio, but we don’t hear it - and we should be able to hear it.

Arrow fixed this in their BD, but as far as I’m aware that’s the only high-definition release that did.

Shout Factory/Scream Factory fixed this as well on it's Blu-ray.

More OOP based on previously being in the "While Supplies Last" sale and now no longer appearing on the website:

Platoon Leader (1988) / Soldier Boyz (1995) (DVD) (BD previously OOP)

Kino announced a Bedtime for Bozo Blu-ray.

....and the KLSC thread at bluray.com rejoiced!

Kino just had to jump on the Dire Announcements This Week bandwagon.

Interesting that they're stating a Brand New 2K Master by KL for Planet of the Vampires when there's already a perfectly fine 2016 restoration made in 4K from the OCN.

They finally dated some of their 4ks:

June 28th
Killer's Kiss (1955) with Dolby Vision HDR
Out of Sight (1998) with Dolby Vision HDR

July 26th
The Killing (1956) with Dolby Vision HDR
Paths of Glory (1957) with Dolby Vision HDR

and on Blu-Ray for the same day:
Planet of the Vampires (1965) new 2k master

They're also going to reissue Marty on BD from a 4k master and two aspect ratios (1.37:1 & 1.85:1) on July 12.

I just noticed KLSC has recently/is soon putting out two more films from the Rock Hudson Comedy Collection, after previously having released Blindfold and Come September...only it's two that Universal had already released on Blu-ray (Man's Favorite Sport and Strange Bedfellows). Apparently Kino is using the same transfers but adding a commentary to each. So what's the hold-up on Has Anybody Seen My Gal?

tenia wrote: Sat Feb 26, 2022 6:41 pm Interesting that they're stating a Brand New 2K Master by KL for Planet of the Vampires when there's already a perfectly fine 2016 restoration made in 4K from the OCN.

It's possible the international rights holder wouldn't grant Kino access to that master or have a high asking price.

ChunkyLover wrote: Sat Feb 26, 2022 8:03 pm

tenia wrote: Sat Feb 26, 2022 6:41 pm Interesting that they're stating a Brand New 2K Master by KL for Planet of the Vampires when there's already a perfectly fine 2016 restoration made in 4K from the OCN.

It's possible the international rights holder wouldn't grant Kino access to that master or have a high asking price.

That is my assumption. Kino only had access to MGM's elements, so they did a 2K scan.

FrauBlucher wrote: Sat Feb 26, 2022 5:52 pm ....and the KLSC thread at bluray.com rejoiced!

The fact that this isn’t a joke, I-

The Night of the Hunter is receiving a 4K UHD release.

More OOP based on previously being in the "While Supplies Last" sale and now no longer appearing on the website:

El Paso (1949) (BD) (DVD still available)
Lovers and Other Strangers (1970) (BD) (DVD previously OOP)

EDIT: DVD version of El Paso has returned to the WSL pages.