criterionforum.org

Amazon.de now says November 30, so it's already been pushed back since that column went to press. And of course that isn't even the first delay. At this point I'm just gonna assume 2013.

...and given that it's a German disc, I'm going to assume no English subtitles.

But I know there are English fansubs out there, so I daresay someone will upload compatible versions not long after it's released.

New Yorker on Facebook re: [i]Celine & Julie[/i] on DVD wrote:It's in the works--no release date set at present, though. Probably between Oct. and Dec. this year.

And lest anyone take this to mean it will only be on DVD, the film is listed on their website in the "Coming Soon on Blu-ray" section.

It was originally announced for the spring, but whatever. FWIW, Film Forum has it for ONE more day. It's a great looking 35mm print, and bear in mind it was shot in 16mm, so it'll be grainier.

I wonder if they'll use the original 16mm camera neg? I would prefer that, but I know some people (not Criterion) ask for the 35mm blow-up...something about minimizing any marks/damage that will seem bigger or more apparent if blown up from 16mm film.

Can you guys think of anyone before Rivette (or after) who have re-cut their projects into entirely different films? Off hand Rivette did this with OUT 1 and LA BELLE NOISEUSE, but I can't think of this being done by anyone else.

Ruiz sort of did that with his last and Pedro Costa seems to have done that with several shorts.

I think Jean-Luc Godard and D.A. Pennebaker did two or three films using the footage from their aborted collaboration - One PM and Two American Audiences? Haven't seen the latter so can't say if that's for sure.

Skolimowski's Hands Up! comes to mind. Also Resnais' pair Smoking and No Smoking, which would seem to have the "different take" at the root of their structure.

Mysteries of Lisbon isn't really the same thing, as there's really just a longer and a shorter version of the same film (although the shorter version has at least one scene not in the longer), whereas Rivette really does strive to make different films out of the shared material - and Divertimento contains no material from La Belle Noiseuse.

There are plenty of examples of experimental filmmakers making multiple films, or versions of films, from the same footage (Anger's Rabbit's Moons; Brakhage's The Art of Vision), and then there's Duras' Son nom de Venise dans Calcutta désert, which reuses the soundtrack from India Song. Michel Gondry put together a B-Roll version of The Science of Sleep, which I haven't seen - that might be the closest thing to Rivette's experiment with La Belle Noiseuse. But multiple versions are actually reasonably common. Assayas made two versions of his masterpiece L'Eau froide (the shorter television version, La Page Blanche, is only two-thirds the length of the theatrical one.) Once you get into contractually-demanded multiple versions of certain films, it's more a question of how inventive and elegant the solution turns out to be. Essentially, Rivette was also just delivering contractually required alternative cuts (La Belle Noiseuse, L'Amour par terre), or trying to salvage the 'unsaleable' (Out 1). It's just that he approached the problem with more creativity than many directors would have, and his tendency to make extremely long movies meant that a greater number of his projects were impacted in this way.

I just remembered one. That sub-Anchorman movie used from outtakes of the main feature. Also the two Malle India docs.

Knives beat me to it with Anchorman. I'd say the director's cut of Until The End of The World qualifies that film. it's really a completely different experience. There are also, to a lesser degree, the film & TV cuts of Bergman's Scenes From a Marriage and Fanny & Alexander. And the "silent" version of Gus Van Sant's harmless but tedious Restless, composed from alternate silent takes of each scene. Which makes me think of all the actual early talkies that were shot for multiple languages, where different takes were used for each language.

hearthesilence wrote:I think Jean-Luc Godard and D.A. Pennebaker did two or three films using the footage from their aborted collaboration - One PM and Two American Audiences? Haven't seen the latter so can't say if that's for sure.

Two American Audiences is a documentary about Gorin and Godard's U.S. speaking tour in support of La Chinoise. It wasn't pieced together from One A.M. footage. Ici et ailleurs is more like what bearcuborg is talking about, except it had a lot of newly-shot footage mixed in. Besides One P.M., Pennebaker also made two shorts out of Monterey Pop footage and outtakes (Jimi Plays Monterey and Shake! Otis at Monterey), while the Maysles made The Beales of Grey Gardens from Grey Gardens outtakes. And Jia Zhangke's Dong is partially made up of footage from Still Life, or vice-versa.

And since zedz brought up "B-roll" versions, Straub-Huillet made two versions of Une Visite au Louvre (which were shown back-to-back at some screenings) and four different versions of The Death of Empedocles. As I understand it, the different versions have the same shot setups and same general editing sequence, but were composed of alternate takes that don't necessarily run the same length, with different lighting conditions and other odd distinctions (one version of Empedocles is called "the lizard version" because a lizard runs across the ground in one shot). The two Visites au Louvre also have different music selections.

There's also Robbe-Grillet's N. Took the Dice made from footage from his Eden and After and alternate takes assembled through the roll of dice.

The Fanciful Norwegian wrote:Ici et ailleurs is more like what bearcuborg is talking about, except it had a lot of newly-shot footage mixed in.

The original film that this was supposed to be never came to fruition though, right?

NilbogSavant wrote:There's also Robbe-Grillet's N. Took the Dice made from footage from his Eden and After and alternate takes assembled through the roll of dice.

Damn. This is the one that was stalled in the back of my head from the moment I read the question.
Robbe-Grillet did something similar in novel form with his La Reprise, a late-career reworking of his first published novel, Les Gommes.

So upset to hear about Rivette, what a crime that an artist of such creative detail should be afflicted with this horrible disease.

I just went and saw Celine & Julie over at film forum too. Remarkable movie, in that having seen it 3 times, I still don't know what to think of it but, can't stop talking about it. More often than not, to people who wouldn't know Jacques Rivette if he fell on top of them but, I'd like to think that he likes it that way.

Celine and Julie will be playing at the Siskel Film Center in Chicago (Aug 17-23). I've heard a lot about him, but still haven't seen anything. Is this a good place to start or should I go with Paris nous appartient on Hulu?

It's a great place to start, and still one of the best filmgoing experiences of my life.

heredity4me wrote:Celine and Julie will be playing at the Siskel Film Center in Chicago (Aug 17-23). I've heard a lot about him, but still haven't seen anything. Is this a good place to start or should I go with Paris nous appartient on Hulu?

Yes! I'm by no means an expert, having only seen the two films you mention plus like 4 hours of Out 1, but I watched Celine and Julie first and have gone back to it a couple of times since then. Still my favorite of the two and 1/3 Rivettes I've seen, and I definitely was glad to have started with it.

From what I've heard it is one of his more accessible films, though that may not be good information. I found Paris nous appertient to be just as accessible, but a lot less playful and less fun overall.

Wonderful wonderful news! Thanks and I am now even more anxious to see it!

Celine et Julie is an absolutely key Rivette and one of his most approachable and entertaining films. After seeing that, you should have a good idea whether or not you're on his wavelength.

i don't think i've ever seen/heard this one mentioned before-anyone know what it is?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071473/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

The uniFrance site has a little more information on it.

http://www.unifrance.org/film/34208/ess ... -agression

ah,ok..thanks for the reply.on another rivette topic-does anyone know the rights situation re la belle noiseuse?i have the new yorker dvd but that's very out of print at his point...if i had to pick one movie i've already seen to get the criterion treatment this would be my choice..an epic masterpiece in a career loaded with them imo...

"Essai sur l'aggression" must be an - unauthorized - extract from "Out 1" or its shorter version "Spectre", not a film in its own right. The same goes for this one: http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0071892/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Both entries on imdb should be discarded.

November 30 is soon. Will this actually happen?