Filmmakers on Other Filmmakers
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
Here are some quotes from Ingmar Bergman on his views about other film-makers from the excellent Ingmar Bergman site.
Here is a link to the location of these quotes because they are a bit hard to find.
On Michelangelo Antonioni:
"He's done two masterpieces, you don't have to bother with the rest. One is Blow-Up, which I've seen many times, and the other is La Notte, also a wonderful film, although that's mostly because of the young Jeanne Moreau. In my collection I have a copy of Il Grido, and damn what a boring movie it is. So devilishly sad, I mean. You know, Antonioni never really learned the trade. He concentrated on single images, never realising that film is a rhythmic flow of images, a movement. Sure, there are brilliant moments in his films. But I don't feel anything for L'Avventura, for example. Only indifference. I never understood why Antonioni was so incredibly applauded. And I thought his muse Monica Vitti was a terrible actress." --Ingmar Bergman, 2002
On Jean-Luc Godard:
"I've never gotten anything out of his movies. They have felt constructed, faux intellectual and completely dead. Cinematographically uninteresting and infinitely boring. Godard is a fucking bore. He's made his films for the critics. One of the movies, Masculin/Féminin, was shot here in Sweden. It was mindnumbingly boring."
On Orson Welles:
"For me he's just a hoax. It's empty. It's not interesting. It's dead. Citizen Kane, which I have a copy of - is all the critics' darling, always at the top of every poll taken, but I think it's a total bore. Above all, the performances are worthless. The amount of respect that movie's got is absolutely unbelievable. Aghed: How about The Magnificent Ambersons? Bergman: Nah. Also terribly boring. And I've never liked Welles as an actor, because he's not really an actor. In Hollywood you have two categories, you talk about actors and personalities. Welles was an enormous personality, but when he plays Othello, everything goes down the drain, you see, that's when he's croaks. In my eyes he's an infinitely overrated filmmaker."
So what do you make of that then?
I actually find his dissenting opinions quite refreshing. Although I love the work of Jean-luc Godard I'm not too keen on Welles or Antonioni either (but I wouldn't go quite as far as Bergman).
The following is also on the site concerning Bergman's favourite films.
In connection to the 18th Göteborg Film Festival 1994, Bergman chose his eleven all time favourite films:
The Circus (Charles Chaplin, USA 1928)
Port of Shadows (Marcel Carné, France 1938)
The Conductor (Andrzej Wajda, Poland 1979)
Raven's End (Bo Widerberg, Sweden 1963)
The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Dreyer, France 1927)
The Phantom Carriage (Victor Sjöström, Sweden 1921)
Rashomon (Akira Kurosawa, Japan 1951)
La Strada (Federico Fellini, Italy 1954)
Sunset Blvd. (Billy Wilder, USA 1950)
Two German Sisters (Margarethe von Trotta, BRD 1981)
Andrei Rublev (Andrei Tarkovsky, Soviet Union 1969)
Here is a link to the location of these quotes because they are a bit hard to find.
On Michelangelo Antonioni:
"He's done two masterpieces, you don't have to bother with the rest. One is Blow-Up, which I've seen many times, and the other is La Notte, also a wonderful film, although that's mostly because of the young Jeanne Moreau. In my collection I have a copy of Il Grido, and damn what a boring movie it is. So devilishly sad, I mean. You know, Antonioni never really learned the trade. He concentrated on single images, never realising that film is a rhythmic flow of images, a movement. Sure, there are brilliant moments in his films. But I don't feel anything for L'Avventura, for example. Only indifference. I never understood why Antonioni was so incredibly applauded. And I thought his muse Monica Vitti was a terrible actress." --Ingmar Bergman, 2002
On Jean-Luc Godard:
"I've never gotten anything out of his movies. They have felt constructed, faux intellectual and completely dead. Cinematographically uninteresting and infinitely boring. Godard is a fucking bore. He's made his films for the critics. One of the movies, Masculin/Féminin, was shot here in Sweden. It was mindnumbingly boring."
On Orson Welles:
"For me he's just a hoax. It's empty. It's not interesting. It's dead. Citizen Kane, which I have a copy of - is all the critics' darling, always at the top of every poll taken, but I think it's a total bore. Above all, the performances are worthless. The amount of respect that movie's got is absolutely unbelievable. Aghed: How about The Magnificent Ambersons? Bergman: Nah. Also terribly boring. And I've never liked Welles as an actor, because he's not really an actor. In Hollywood you have two categories, you talk about actors and personalities. Welles was an enormous personality, but when he plays Othello, everything goes down the drain, you see, that's when he's croaks. In my eyes he's an infinitely overrated filmmaker."
So what do you make of that then?
I actually find his dissenting opinions quite refreshing. Although I love the work of Jean-luc Godard I'm not too keen on Welles or Antonioni either (but I wouldn't go quite as far as Bergman).
The following is also on the site concerning Bergman's favourite films.
In connection to the 18th Göteborg Film Festival 1994, Bergman chose his eleven all time favourite films:
The Circus (Charles Chaplin, USA 1928)
Port of Shadows (Marcel Carné, France 1938)
The Conductor (Andrzej Wajda, Poland 1979)
Raven's End (Bo Widerberg, Sweden 1963)
The Passion of Joan of Arc (Carl Dreyer, France 1927)
The Phantom Carriage (Victor Sjöström, Sweden 1921)
Rashomon (Akira Kurosawa, Japan 1951)
La Strada (Federico Fellini, Italy 1954)
Sunset Blvd. (Billy Wilder, USA 1950)
Two German Sisters (Margarethe von Trotta, BRD 1981)
Andrei Rublev (Andrei Tarkovsky, Soviet Union 1969)
- toiletduck!
- Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 5:43 pm
- Location: The 'Go
- Contact:
- Barmy
- Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 3:59 pm
Well, his list of favourite films is, mostly, very old school and B.O.R.I.N.G.
I've always felt Godard and Welles are overrated, even though I find much of their work to be interesting.
Antonioni is one of my all-time faves, but I can appreciate the criticism. In a way I don't really disagree with what ol' Bergy says about il Maestro.
I've always felt Godard and Welles are overrated, even though I find much of their work to be interesting.
Antonioni is one of my all-time faves, but I can appreciate the criticism. In a way I don't really disagree with what ol' Bergy says about il Maestro.
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
I'm not familiar with all of the films on his list but I was very surprised by Sunset Blvd (I'm not saying it's a bad film).Barmy wrote:Well, his list of favourite films is, mostly, very old school and B.O.R.I.N.G.
I'm definitely with him on Passion of Joan of Arc and Phantom Carriage by my most beloved of all film-makers, Victor Sjöström.
Any film by Tarkovsky has got to be a good choice.
- hearthesilence
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:22 am
- Location: NYC
ASSHOLE. And I say that as someone who loves Bergman's work (duh...)
The Antonioni diss I can understand, he's not the only one to make similiar criticisms. Godard, I guess it's not surprising because Godard's films have an impish sense of humor to them, which I love, and that's something you rarely see in any of Bergman's work. But "cinematographically uninteresting and infinitely boring"? Whoaaah....
As for Welles, well, to be fair, Kane has been criticized as cold and even hollow...I recall hearing such criticisms when people make the case for Ambersons as the better picture. And Ambersons was definitely ridiculed as too slow and boring when they previewed it in Pomona. But I wouldn't expect those criticisms from BERGMAN, of all people. He's totally OTM about actors and personalities, and I think Welles is definitely a personality (I love Welles, and I love his performances in Falstaff and Kane among others, but he can be a bit of a ham). I'm not sure I'd rake him over the coals for that. ANY star can be labelled a 'personality' regardless of their talents - Chaplin, Cary Grant, Bogart, Cagney, Brando, etc....
The Antonioni diss I can understand, he's not the only one to make similiar criticisms. Godard, I guess it's not surprising because Godard's films have an impish sense of humor to them, which I love, and that's something you rarely see in any of Bergman's work. But "cinematographically uninteresting and infinitely boring"? Whoaaah....
As for Welles, well, to be fair, Kane has been criticized as cold and even hollow...I recall hearing such criticisms when people make the case for Ambersons as the better picture. And Ambersons was definitely ridiculed as too slow and boring when they previewed it in Pomona. But I wouldn't expect those criticisms from BERGMAN, of all people. He's totally OTM about actors and personalities, and I think Welles is definitely a personality (I love Welles, and I love his performances in Falstaff and Kane among others, but he can be a bit of a ham). I'm not sure I'd rake him over the coals for that. ANY star can be labelled a 'personality' regardless of their talents - Chaplin, Cary Grant, Bogart, Cagney, Brando, etc....
- Cinephrenic
- Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 2:58 pm
- Location: Paris, Texas
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
I would definitely defend Bergman for having strong opinions. He's just speaking his mind honestly. I think it's healthy for people to express their opinions even if they do radically stray from the popular consensus - and I say that as a huge fan of both Bergman and Godard.hearthesilence wrote:ASSHOLE. And I say that as someone who loves Bergman's work (duh...)
- miless
- Joined: Sat Apr 01, 2006 9:45 pm
- Michael Kerpan
- Spelling Bee Champeen
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
- Location: New England
- Contact:
Oh -- Bergman has the _right_ to express his views -- but we have the right to note that his remarks are mean-spirited and vacuous. If posted on a board like this by an unknown, his remarks would (rightly) be viewed as trollish.vogler wrote:I would definitely defend Bergman for having strong opinions. He's just speaking his mind honestly. I think it's healthy for people to express their opinions even if they do radically stray from the popular consensus - and I say that as a huge fan of both Bergman and Godard.
Whatever his virtues as a film maker may be, they don't carry over to his film criticism.
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
It should be remembered that Bergman is equally harsh about his own films. He's not trying to imply that these film-makers are crap and he is the greatest.miless wrote:I would rather watch his films than hear him talk about film... he has his share of terrible films (The Serpents Egg being the most pronounced)
- Michael Kerpan
- Spelling Bee Champeen
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
- Location: New England
- Contact:
What is your basis for saying that he is not dismissing the work of Godard and Welles as "crap"? He is saying their work is utterly valueless -- seems close enough to "crap" to me.vogler wrote:It should be remembered that Bergman is equally harsh about his own films. He's not trying to imply that these film-makers are crap and he is the greatest.
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
No, the emphasis there was on the bit about him not saying that he is the greatest. I'm just saying that he is equally critical of his own and others films.Michael Kerpan wrote:What is your basis for saying that he is not dismissing the work of Godard and Welles as "crap"? He is saying their work is utterly valueless -- seems close enough to "crap" to me.vogler wrote:It should be remembered that Bergman is equally harsh about his own films. He's not trying to imply that these film-makers are crap and he is the greatest.
- Michael Kerpan
- Spelling Bee Champeen
- Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:20 pm
- Location: New England
- Contact:
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
What does this mean? It sounds a bit hostile. These are Bergmans comments on films which are considered very important and since Bergman is also a very important film-maker I thought that people might be interested in them. Don't shoot the messenger - I'm not trying to provoke anyone. I may have misunderstood your comment though.Michael Kerpan wrote:If posted on a board like this by an unknown, his remarks would (rightly) be viewed as trollish.
I have to say that I laughed out loud when I read the Godard comment. I love much of Godards work and from my point of view Bergman is way off on that but I still found it interesting to read what he thought.
I am also wondering about the translation of these comments - do you think it is possible that they didn't sound quite as harsh as that when he said them (presumably) in Swedish?
- vogler
- Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 8:42 am
- Location: England
- hearthesilence
- Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:22 am
- Location: NYC
Welles hasn't even made 20, period. Actually, he's had about 20 that never got off the ground...I guess you can't call them "films" if they've never been finished, or even shot, but they are, indeed, useless.
It's kind of amusing. You never expect filmmakers to act like such primadonnas in a bitch-slap contest.
[edit: this was in a response to a post that mysteriously vanished]
It's kind of amusing. You never expect filmmakers to act like such primadonnas in a bitch-slap contest.
[edit: this was in a response to a post that mysteriously vanished]
- Barmy
- Joined: Mon May 16, 2005 3:59 pm
According to Bergman, Godard made 89 sucky films and Welles made, or attempted to make, 40 sucky films (just going by imdb).
I'm glad Welles hated Bergman. Apparently he hated Antonioni too.
Who does Godard hate?
Who does Antonioni hate?
I'd love to know.
I'm glad Welles hated Bergman. Apparently he hated Antonioni too.
Who does Godard hate?
Who does Antonioni hate?
I'd love to know.
Last edited by Barmy on Wed Sep 13, 2006 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.