Licorice Pizza (Paul Thomas Anderson, 2021)

[nitin]

Film of 2021 for me based on what I have seen so far, and I can understand arguments that have been made (elsewhere not this board) that there is a bit of a male fantasy aspect to the relationship, but they do not diminish my love for the characters or the vignettes that Anderson cooks up for them. Anderson has not been this unqualifiedly romantic since Punch Drunk Love and this loose and shaggy since Boogie Nights, and that combination puts it only behind Magnolia for me.

[HinkyDinkyTruesmith]

I've always found those arguments confusing considering that Alana is the primary character of the film and is far more fleshed out than other examples of male fantasy female characters. Perhaps one can imagine her nothing but a male fantasy if they ignore the film from her point of view and focus on her solely from the mindset of a 15 year old boy.

[DeprongMori]

Sean Penn spotted on set, though from his appearance he doesn’t seem to be in costume and could just be visiting

If this production is following COVID-19 protocols, I'd be surprised if visitors were even allowed.

To get back to this, John C. Reilly recently said that he got a COVID test solely so that he could visit the set of this, so it's possible that Penn did the same.

Finally saw Licorice Pizza, and am making my way through the 11 pages of comments before making more substantive observations.

Question: Was that in fact John C. Reilly as “Herman Munster” at the Teen Fair? The closing credits listed “Herman Munster” and “Lily Munster” with “as Themselves”, but his voice was pretty unmistakable. I have no idea who the Lily Munster cameo was — it went by too quick.

[Roger Ryan]

If this production is following COVID-19 protocols, I'd be surprised if visitors were even allowed.

To get back to this, John C. Reilly recently said that he got a COVID test solely so that he could visit the set of this, so it's possible that Penn did the same.

Finally saw Licorice Pizza, and am making my way through the 11 pages of comments before making more substantive observations.

Question: Was that in fact John C. Reilly as “Herman Munster” at the Teen Fair? The closing credits listed “Herman Munster” and “Lily Munster” with “as Themselves”, but his voice was pretty unmistakable. I have no idea who the Lily Munster cameo was — it went by too quick.

Yes, that's Reilly... and he's credited with the part on IMDb. I like how this brief moment plays into the subtext of the film that so many of the characters (apart from Gary for the most part) are "playing roles" or pretending to be something they're not. It gives Reilly's one line extra significance when he announces he is the real Herman Munster as if such a thing was possible.

[mfunk9786]

If this production is following COVID-19 protocols, I'd be surprised if visitors were even allowed.

To get back to this, John C. Reilly recently said that he got a COVID test solely so that he could visit the set of this, so it's possible that Penn did the same.

Finally saw Licorice Pizza, and am making my way through the 11 pages of comments before making more substantive observations.

Question: Was that in fact John C. Reilly as “Herman Munster” at the Teen Fair? The closing credits listed “Herman Munster” and “Lily Munster” with “as Themselves”, but his voice was pretty unmistakable. I have no idea who the Lily Munster cameo was — it went by too quick.

Yes, but you'll also see people claiming Ben Stiller's in it and I am still extremely skeptical about that. Certainly not the guy working with Penn at the audition.

[DeprongMori]

I haven’t seen it mentioned anywhere, but the movie/character that Alana is auditioning for (“Rainbow”) with William Holden is undoubtedly Breezy, which eventually co-starred Kay Lenz. It was directed by Clint Eastwood (though the “director” in the film more closely resembled Francis Ford Coppola to me).

[hearthesilence]

Yes, but you'll also see people claiming Ben Stiller's in it and I am still extremely skeptical about that. Certainly not the guy working with Penn at the audition.

Yeah, I didn't think it looked like Stiller either. The eyes and ears alone were too different.

[therewillbeblus]

Look, I'm not going to die on a hill for this one, but the entire theory is that it's a Pynchonesque master of disguise. Of course there will be makeup to deter one from spotting Waldo

[brundlefly]

I haven’t seen it mentioned anywhere, but the movie/character that Alana is auditioning for (“Rainbow”) with William Holden is undoubtedly Breezy, which eventually co-starred Kay Lenz. It was directed by Clint Eastwood (though the “director” in the film more closely resembled Francis Ford Coppola to me).

Breezy is mentioned in Vikram Murthi's appreciation in The Nation. The excruciating audition dialogue about Intercourse, Pennsylvania is from there.

[Brian C]

Look, I'm not going to die on a hill for this one, but the entire theory is that it's a Pynchonesque master of disguise. Of course there will be makeup to deter one from spotting Waldo

It really seems like you’re dangerously close to the point where the nature of the “theory” is that it can’t be disproven.

[therewillbeblus]

The running joke around Pynchon's cameo in Inherent Vice wasn't proven or disproven either, and PTA had great fun in keeping audiences at arm's length from any tangible solution in the spirit of a Pynchon novel. My point is that if the character is played by Ben Stiller -and given PTA's provocative ignorant play with the interviewer in the link upthread, and the ghost-written account of the character who PTA declared to be a real director and played by himself in said interview (as they're discussing actors involved he says, "That's Sam Harpoon" over and over), thus prolonging some long-game gag around this character - well, he would certainly be masked. I am not taking this seriously enough to engage some kind of "dangerous" sincere logic, just saying that facial aspects being manipulated for a person intended to be disguised would.. make sense... If PTA puts the Stiller rumors to rest by outright saying the character is played by Dan Chariton, cool- but he hasn't done that and went to lengths to cheekily reinforce the mythmaking around this character, including deliberately providing vague detours in response to the suspicions of it being Stiller. Maybe it is Dan Chariton! But I'll try to hold onto my theory without intending to create dangerous rhetoric.

[Brian C]

I didn’t mean “dangerous” in the people-may-die sense, just the usual internet-rabbit-hole sense. If that helps.

[therewillbeblus]

I didn't think you thought anyone was going to die, but I felt like you were issuing a weightier challenge at odds with the lighter commitment I have to this playful 'Sam Harpoon joke', whatever it may be, and so that seemed worth clarifying

[flexibleheart]

I don't know whether it's funny or sad how much he's letting this Haim band ruin him. Maybe that's not fair wording as it assigns the girls blame. To answer the question he says in interviews that he asked while making the film, yes you've completely lost your mind over them. This felt like a series of really wrong-headed decisions that it was kind of shocking. Was this an attempt to remake Inherent Vice without Pynchon a la Phantom Thread being more audience-friendly than The Master?

-The rushed beginning. Why should we be invested in these characters? We don't take any time to be properly introduced to them before we're asked to find this relationship compelling.

-The Life on Mars needle drop was a big eye roll. He's saying in interviews that you need to earn the use of a song like that, well he didn't.

-The Jerry Frick stuff was pointless and sloppy. Let's not pretend that he's interested in making some commentary about the racism of that time. I'm actually more irritated by the depiction of the homosexual characters. Peter's assistant is a caricature and is he trying to draw a parallel between homosexuality and dating someone underage?

-For all the raves she's getting, I thought Haim was just adequate. She overacts a lot. I preferred Hoffman. It feels like a testament to him that he manages to be remotely likeable and charming because Gary as written is pretty loathsome.

-Every single man (and apparently most of the women/girls hitting on Gary?) wanting to fuck Alana was a little silly.

-And the running motif was the biggest eye roll of them all. The whole ending basically encapsulates all these bizarre choices during the whole film.

-The Mary Grady scene stands out as maybe the only truly memorable scene. Even the truck scene did little for me. There's no actual suspense. You never think anything of consequence is going to happen to these characters.

I didn't like OUATIH nor have I ever cared about this supposed friendly rivalry with Tarantino. So, it's disappointing that he reverted to that and made an even weaker film than OUATIH. I think he's been a little lost at sea (heh) since The Master but this was shockingly borderline incompetent.

I don't know, I just wasn't charmed at all and don't understand why he thought this was worth making or a story worth telling. The only explanation is he just had to make something that he could put all of Haim into. He got over Aimee Mann and Joanna Newsom pretty quickly. Can't think Haim era be over soon, please?

[therewillbeblus]

-Also what’s the deal with the title, licorice doesn’t go on pizza

[Ned Merrill Streep]

I liked this film, but I honestly think that this is really Altman-lite (and we know how PTA has made a couple of terrific homages to his hero), so it's not like he was doing anything particularly experimental here. I feel like the ensemble was good but underused - I feel like a longer film could've given us more time with genuinely interesting people like those in the supporting cast (Cooper, Penn, Waits, HSH etc.), since they're great, but they don't feel all that developed. They compartmentalize the film and make it seem quite disjointed. Weaving them together in a more consistent manner would've been much better IMHO.

[dekadetia]

-Also what’s the deal with the title, licorice doesn’t go on pizza

Though not for lack of trying: https://slate.com/human-interest/2021/1 ... ecipe.html

[lacritfan]

Sam Harpoon in person

[DarkImbecile]

Get busy booking that flight, twbb

[therewillbeblus]

30 min for a film and a Q&A?! Stiller'll be on stage about as long as he's in Licorice Pizza!

[Never Cursed]

Screenings of this will now feature a new Haim/Anderson music video played before the film

[lacritfan]

Sam Harpoon at American Cinematheque
(I wasn't there, just got it off Twitter)

[erok910]

No need to be there to know it's a joke. Wouldn't have seen this otherwise, thanks to all who kept this Sam Harpoon business updated. Happy to see it resolved in any case.

Also still wondering when it will hit VOD. I saw some reported stuff about March, but the re-release/addition with the Haim video makes me think it will be longer than I expected.

[erok910]

Licorice Pizza seems to be available for rent and purchase on iTunes as of today, for anyone interested.

[mfunk9786]

Do Boomers even like this movie? Isn't the core viewing audience younger?

My father declined to meet up and see it, the first PTA film he has just totally passed on since Magnolia (due to, I guess, its length and general subject matter), due to it "seeming like kind of a young people thing."

I don't know whether it's funny or sad how much he's letting this Haim band ruin him. Maybe that's not fair wording as it assigns the girls blame. To answer the question he says in interviews that he asked while making the film, yes you've completely lost your mind over them. This felt like a series of really wrong-headed decisions that it was kind of shocking. Was this an attempt to remake Inherent Vice without Pynchon a la Phantom Thread being more audience-friendly than The Master?

-The rushed beginning. Why should we be invested in these characters? We don't take any time to be properly introduced to them before we're asked to find this relationship compelling.

-The Life on Mars needle drop was a big eye roll. He's saying in interviews that you need to earn the use of a song like that, well he didn't.

-The Jerry Frick stuff was pointless and sloppy. Let's not pretend that he's interested in making some commentary about the racism of that time. I'm actually more irritated by the depiction of the homosexual characters. Peter's assistant is a caricature and is he trying to draw a parallel between homosexuality and dating someone underage?

-For all the raves she's getting, I thought Haim was just adequate. She overacts a lot. I preferred Hoffman. It feels like a testament to him that he manages to be remotely likeable and charming because Gary as written is pretty loathsome.

-Every single man (and apparently most of the women/girls hitting on Gary?) wanting to fuck Alana was a little silly.

-And the running motif was the biggest eye roll of them all. The whole ending basically encapsulates all these bizarre choices during the whole film.

-The Mary Grady scene stands out as maybe the only truly memorable scene. Even the truck scene did little for me. There's no actual suspense. You never think anything of consequence is going to happen to these characters.

I didn't like OUATIH nor have I ever cared about this supposed friendly rivalry with Tarantino. So, it's disappointing that he reverted to that and made an even weaker film than OUATIH. I think he's been a little lost at sea (heh) since The Master but this was shockingly borderline incompetent.

I don't know, I just wasn't charmed at all and don't understand why he thought this was worth making or a story worth telling. The only explanation is he just had to make something that he could put all of Haim into. He got over Aimee Mann and Joanna Newsom pretty quickly. Can't think Haim era be over soon, please?

Had to shout this out for being one of the most batshit posts I've seen lurking on these forums in a long time. Whew! Where to begin, but here's where I'll end