BFI (British Film Institute)

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MichaelB
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#551 Post by MichaelB »

Every time I see MoC being brought up in these Blu-ray region-coding discussions, I think of the famous Mr Wu anecdote, as told by Orson Welles:
In theatre, you know, the old star actors never liked to come on until the end of the first act. Mister Wu is a classic example--I've played it once myself. All the other actors boil around the stage for about an hour shrieking, 'What will happen when Mr. Wu arrives?,' 'What is he like, this Mr. Wu?,' and so on. Finally a great gong is beaten and slowly, over a Chinese bridge, comes Mr. Wu himself in full mandarin robes. Peach Blossom, or whatever her name is, falls on her face and a lot of coolies yell, 'Mister Wu!!!' The curtain comes down, the audience goes wild, and everybody says, 'Isn't that guy playing Mr. Wu a great actor!' That's a star part for you! What matters in that kind of role is not how many lines you have, but how few. What counts is how much the other characters talk about you. Such a star vehicle really is a vehicle. All you have to do is ride.
MoC has done some sterling work in DVD production over the years, so it's entirely reasonable that expectations would have built up to fever pitch - but I can't help noticing that at the time of writing they've released one Blu-ray disc (Mad Detective) and announced one more (Tokyo Sonata) - both of which are East Asian films made in the last two years. Given the gap between the extravagant praise I'm seeing round these parts for MoC's apparently fearless Blu-ray policy and the actual fruit that it's borne so far, wouldn't you agree that they're currently the Blu-ray distribution equivalent of Mr. Wu?

I'm sure things will change over the next few months, and it'll be very interesting to see how their line-up pans out - but it is mildly irritating to see them constantly cited as paragons of Blu-ray distribution when they've yet to really prove themselves in the format. Once they get some silent stuff out, or something equally elderly and challenging, or bring off a region-free deal with a sales agent who's previously insisted on region-coding, then I'll join the chorus!
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ellipsis7
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#552 Post by ellipsis7 »

It's not about individual labels, but rather the diversity of titles available in Region B, hopefully from a range of Blu Ray publishers. I could have just the same named several BFI DVD titles - Renoir's THE RIVER & LA REGLE DU JEU, Visconti's LA TERRA TREMA & IL GATTOPARDO, Rossellini's VOYAGE TO ITALY - which if they were released in Blu Ray editions, would accumulatively be persuasive for purchasing a region locked Blu Ray player, rather than waiting (in Ireland for Godot, who never turns up, but nevertheless also gets good press, like Mr Wu) to see how things pan out...
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zedz
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Re: BFI Blu-ray Region Guide

#553 Post by zedz »

MichaelB wrote:
I believe the real gripe is with the current state of technology in which investment in multi-region BluRay equipment means a bigger investment than it did for SD DVD. That is really it, and there's absolutely nothing the BFI, nor any other label (aside from Sony I suppose), can do about that. But like anything else, expect these costs to come down eventually. If [Kekid] actually shelled out the funds for a multi-region setup, he wouldn't be saying one iota against the terms of rights and contracts.
This really hits the nail on the head. It's the absence of region-free BluRay players that's the root cause of the frustration. Imagine if DVD region coding (still prevalent internationally, even if most of us ignore it) was still effective: we'd all be railing against that. BluRay region-locking - like DVD region-locking - is the industry norm. One just happens to be more effective than the other.
kekid wrote:One man's protest may not make much diffference to a business, but I feel a need to protest a discriminatory policy that excludes audiences.
If this really were a matter of principle for you, why wouldn't you be boycotting Criterion? In what sense is their region-locking not, in your terms, "a discriminatory policy that excludes audiences"? Presumable answer: "it doesn't exclude me." So much for principles!
forweg
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#554 Post by forweg »

MichaelB wrote:MoC has done some sterling work in DVD production over the years, so it's entirely reasonable that expectations would have built up to fever pitch - but I can't help noticing that at the time of writing they've released one Blu-ray disc (Mad Detective) and announced one more (Tokyo Sonata) - both of which are East Asian films made in the last two years. Given the gap between the extravagant praise I'm seeing round these parts for MoC's apparently fearless Blu-ray policy and the actual fruit that it's borne so far, wouldn't you agree that they're currently the Blu-ray distribution equivalent of Mr. Wu?

I'm sure things will change over the next few months, and it'll be very interesting to see how their line-up pans out - but it is mildly irritating to see them constantly cited as paragons of Blu-ray distribution when they've yet to really prove themselves in the format. Once they get some silent stuff out, or something equally elderly and challenging, or bring off a region-free deal with a sales agent who's previously insisted on region-coding, then I'll join the chorus!
I don't understand the dismissive attitude towards Mad Detective and Tokyo Sonata. Frankly, these titles are some of the most risky and "challenging" I could imagine MoC releasing, considering every other hardcore film snob label seems to find modern Asian films below them (except Wong Kar-wai, for whatever reason).
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MichaelB
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#555 Post by MichaelB »

forweg wrote:I don't understand the dismissive attitude towards Mad Detective and Tokyo Sonata. Frankly, these titles are some of the most risky and "challenging" I could imagine MoC releasing, considering every other hardcore film snob label seems to find modern Asian films below them (except Wong Kar-wai, for whatever reason).
I'm not dismissing those two films as being unworthy as such (I haven't seen the Kurosawa, but I thought Mad Detective was superb), but I do find it bizarre that MoC is constantly getting singled out in Blu-ray discussion threads when they haven't really done that much yet, either in terms of quantity or range - even though they launched their first (and so far only) Blu-ray disc at about the same time as Artificial Eye and the BFI's initial forays into the format, and a couple of months before Criterion's.

And for a label which rightly takes considerable pride in spanning the bulk of film history with its DVD catalogue, it's equally curious that its first two Blu-ray discs should both have been made in the last couple of years - given that the Blu-ray catalogue is already massively biased towards post-2000 films.

But, as I said, I'm sure things will change radically over the next few months, and I'm greatly looking forward to seeing it happen.
akaten

Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#556 Post by akaten »

If anything, I'm concerned with the region free policy of MOC, I'd rather that, so long as they have the materials available they put out every film they possibily can on blu ray rather than hold back for the sake of principle. I certainly don't want to miss out on a blu ray release of any MOC title simply due to region locking.

Really not sure what the ongoing issue here is, every cinephile loses out with region locking until affordable multi region players become available, just a case of being patient or 'making do' with what are by all accounts excellent DVD presentations based on the same materials.

Until such time have to be patient but also accept that, on balance North Americans will most likely find themselves in a far better position overall. So far there has been Criterion offerings, The Sand Pebbles (never even got the 2dvd in this country so looks unlikely the blu ray will turn up) as well as a personal favourite of mine Wings of Honneamise all being unavailable to play on my current blu ray player, and no doubt others will follow. Could also mention Akira but I'm certain that'll turn up here soon, not sure if the rights remain with Manga or now with the European Bandai division Beez.

Incidentally while people have praised the Jeff Keen set from BFI (yet to try but his work looks fascinating) I think also deserving of top billing for the most impressive feat has to have been when Bandai were able to put out the Freedom OVA boxset around the world on the sameday late last year. Of course that was only possible by owning the rights and having the means to press the discs and sets in Japan and ship them around the world on time. To be honest I doubt they will try it too often if at all again, what with the strong yen and limited paying audience for such offerings.

Anyway back on topic, clearly BFI are doing an excellent job pushing forward with blu ray releases far and beyond what others are doing and that will pay dividends for all cinephiles down the line.
Adam
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Re: BFI Blu-ray Region Guide

#557 Post by Adam »

kekid wrote:This is a well-argued response, and I cannot refute any of it.

My actions are based on where I am located. Criterion's decisions do not affect me. I would have been infuriated with them if I was a region B consumer. I remain unhappy about (most of) the BFI Blu Rays not being accessible to the Region 1 customers, and will not buy those in any form, regardless of whose decisions prompted that situation. Whether you do the same with the Criterions is your choice.

It is incomprehensible that in these times of low consumption resulting from global economic crisis the program owners limit sales through region-coding.
The correct ones to boycott or be angry at are the studios or the rights holders, not Criterion, MoC, BFI, or any of those. And even then i would say that it's kinda meaningless to be angry about it.

The owners actually make more money by selling region-by-region than they do selling all regions to one distributor. For example, a rights holder might get $10,000 for US rights, $5000 for UK rights, $2000 for GErman rights, $4000 for Japanese rights, and so on around the world, as opposed to getting just $20,000 from one company for world rights.

And selling by territory actually gives greater sales, as each distributor will know better how to distribute & publicize within its own territory. As an example, BFI isn't arranging reviews in American newspapers or arranging shelf space in a Borders in Michigan. Criterion might. So it makes sense for the owners of a title to sell the UK to BFI and the US to Criterion, separately, and have each region-locked. It would also then be in Criterion's & BFI's interests to also have the discs region-locked, so that a foreign version of the Blu-ray doesn't encroach on their sales. So your argument, based on concern over their limiting sales, is more likely the owners' argument to use region-encoding to expand sales.
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ellipsis7
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#558 Post by ellipsis7 »

The people who could make a huge difference with their huge catalogue in a potential Blu Ray revolution (transcending region coding) are Studio Canal who could release from the same 24P HD master in France (Studio Canal), UK/Ireland (through subsidiary Optimum), and USA (through the Lionsgate deal, with opt outs to Criterion)...
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ellipsis7
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#559 Post by ellipsis7 »

249 AUD for the Kogan is about €130 - sounds reasonable... Cheapest Blu Ray hereabouts (and locked to region B) Sony BDP S350 is €239 - buy with a multiregion mod (from Stegen) that model sells at €499...

I suppose you're right, David, about the region spread, but it all seems slow to happen on Blu...

Just searching, no Kogans on Ebay, and sold out currently on their own site, but is this not the first multiregion Blu Ray player out of the box? Great news then...

MichaelB - over on the Warner/ZABRISKIE POINT thread, one Richard--W has just post this nugget of rumour or information...
A widescreen, anamorphic and fully restored Zabriskie Point will be released in the U.K. May 25, I think by the BFI.
Warner Home Video will release the same restoration in the USA June 30.
Seems unlikely, but can you confirm or deny?... Surely all the May titles from the BFI have been announced, and this would come out on Warner label if released in R2 UK/IRL?... I stand to be corrected...

Link to the WB/ZP thread...
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MichaelB
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#560 Post by MichaelB »

I honestly don't know either way.

UPDATE: Neither does BFI DVD Publishing, so there's your answer!
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ellipsis7
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#561 Post by ellipsis7 »

Well, I succumbed, and picked up a Sony BDP S350 locked to Region B, and the BFI RED DESERT does indeed now look impressive... I have the player alongside my high end (non upscaling) progessive scan DVD player, both with HDMI output via a new switcher to the HD projector... I also broke the DVD region coding on the Sony Blu Ray with a oneforall remote... As I have both the SDVD and the Blu Ray discs of the BFI RED DESERT, I was able to run both simultaneously and make a direct comparison, turning from one to the other via the HDMI switcher... And indeed if one gives the Blu Ray a top mark of 10/10, the SDVD comes in at a very good 7.5/10... However then playing the RD SDVD on the Blu Player (now with DVD upscaling function) I'd only rate the image then as a much poorer 5/10, so I'm very much sticking with my current DVD player for SDVDs... And look forward to future BFI releases both in Blu & DVD!...
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MichaelB
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#562 Post by MichaelB »

ellipsis7 wrote:However then playing the RD SDVD on the Blu Player (now with DVD upscaling function) I'd only rate the image then as a much poorer 5/10, so I'm very much sticking with my current DVD player for SDVDs... And look forward to future BFI releases both in Blu & DVD!...
Yes, even if my PS3 was multiregion (ha!), there's no way I'd use it as a substitute DVD player. Fortunately, between deciding to buy a particular model of 42" plasma telly and actually going out and paying for it, the price dropped enough to justify splashing out on an Oppo 983, which made all the difference.
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Dr Amicus
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#563 Post by Dr Amicus »

Winstanley, due 27th April, DVD and Blu-Ray.

A Moviemail exclusive

I haven't seen this before - nor indeed It Happened Here - and only know Brownlow from his superb documentaries. However, this has been on my want-to-watch list for ages - and from the end of the month can go into my endless kevyip pile...
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foggy eyes
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#564 Post by foggy eyes »

Dr Amicus wrote:Winstanley, due 27th April, DVD and Blu-Ray. [...] I haven't seen this before - nor indeed It Happened Here - and only know Brownlow from his superb documentaries. However, this has been on my want-to-watch list for ages - and from the end of the month can go into my endless kevyip pile...
It's brilliant - a sort-of retroactive missing link between Russian formalism and Italian neorealism, or late silent and early "realist" sound cinema. Every single composition is striking or beautiful in some way, and overall it's one of the few British films that accurately represent the meteorology and topography of our landscape (right down to the changing of the seasons). The non-professional performances are hit-and-miss, but their unforced naturalism acts as a perfect counterpoint to the sheer expressiveness of the style. The Blu-ray will probably look amazing!

For those in the UK, Winstanley & It Happened Here are screening at the Watershed in Bristol on 23/05, followed by Gance's La Roue the next day (introduced by Brownlow and accompanied by Guenter Buchwald & Neil Brand).
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MichaelB
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#565 Post by MichaelB »

MichaelB wrote:it's likely that the region-free proportion of the BFI's catalogue will grow over the next few months, as it becomes more diverse
I'm delighted to confirm that my prediction above is coming to pass - following the latest flurry of BFI announcements and region confirmations, the ratio of region-locked to region-free releases is now at 8:6, up from 4:1 when I originally made that comment.

In other words, region-free Blu-rays are up from 0% of the catalogue in January to 20% in March to 43% in May - and educated guesswork based on upcoming releases suggests that region-free discs will be in the majority before too long.

And I'm particularly pleased to note that while stuff licensed from the majors is almost invariably region-locked (for their own commercial reasons, over which the BFI obviously has no sway whatsoever), it's not only the directly BFI-owned stuff that's getting a region-free release - it's just been confirmed that the Kenneth Anger Magick Lantern Cycle will also be region-free.
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ouatitw
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#566 Post by ouatitw »

I'm amazed that BFI will release the dwoskin (thanks). I'm curious is there going to be a bluray release as well?
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Cash Flagg
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#567 Post by Cash Flagg »

The Glue Man wrote:Mar 23 2009:

Bodysong (DVD)
Bodysong (Blu-ray)
Has this been postponed? It's listed as temporarily out of stock on Amazon, but DVD Source gives the disc a 5/18 release date.
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tojoed
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#568 Post by tojoed »

James Broughton's "The Pleasure Garden" is being released on 8th June 2009 according to Moviemail.
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foggy eyes
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#569 Post by foggy eyes »

tojoed wrote:James Broughton's "The Pleasure Garden" is being released on 8th June 2009 according to Moviemail.
Good news, but unless they release more the Facets set will remain a better (and more cost-effective) option.

There's a (complete?) Dwoskin retro at the NFT in May, so hopefully more of his films will emerge on DVD afterwards...
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ouatitw
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#570 Post by ouatitw »

foggy eyes wrote:There's a (complete?) Dwoskin retro at the NFT in May, so hopefully more of his films will emerge on DVD afterwards...
This is pretty cool, and I wish I lived where I could actually go. I hope this will lead to more Dwoskin releases, but almost everyone of these films already has a DVD release (and they are quality editions). The Sun and The Moon (and possibly some of the shorts, the titles aren't listed) are the only ones playing without a DVD release.

edit -- never mind I found the shorts and many don't have a release: Asleep (USA 1961, 4min); Alone (USA 1963, 13min); Moment (UK 1968, 13min); Trixi (UK 1970, 30min) all are missing releases. It would be great if there is a DVD of his unreleased shorts released in the near future.
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foggy eyes
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#571 Post by foggy eyes »

ouatitw wrote:I hope this will lead to more Dwoskin releases, but almost everyone of these films already has a DVD release (and they are quality editions). The Sun and The Moon (and possibly some of the shorts, the titles aren't listed) are the only ones playing without a DVD release.

edit -- never mind I found the shorts and many don't have a release: Asleep (USA 1961, 4min); Alone (USA 1963, 13min); Moment (UK 1968, 13min); Trixi (UK 1970, 30min) all are missing releases. It would be great if there is a DVD of his unreleased shorts released in the near future.
I'm too lazy to look these up - could you give a brief rundown of where the films can be found? I have the LUX/Re:Voir disc of Dyn Amo, and remember seeing a rather expensive box of 14 films knocking about that would probably cover the rest - was that released by Re:Voir too?
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ouatitw
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#572 Post by ouatitw »

Yeah they are all in one boxset which includes 5 DVDs and 14 Films. This is who makes it, you can order it directly from them, MovieMail, Chalet Films, or Re:Voir Video. And the contents:

Dvd 1
Take me, 1968, 30’, N&B, 16mm
Dirty, 1971, 10’, N&B, 16mm
Girl, 1975, 30’, color, 16mm
Dad, 2003, 12’, color, video
Grandpère’pear, 2003, 5’, N&B, video
Dear Frances (in memoriam), color, 2003, 18', video

Dvd 2
Pain is..., color, 1997, 80’, 16mm,
original English version (French, German, Spanish subtitles),
Intoxicated by my illness, color, 2001, 62’, video

Dvd 3
Tod und Teufel, 1973, color, 94’, 16mm,
original German version (French, English, Spanish subtitles)
Face Anthea, color, 1990, 60’, video

Dvd 4
Behindert, color, 1970, 96’, 16mm,
original German/English version
(French, English, German, Spanish subtitles),
Outside in, color, 1981, 105’, 16mm,
original English version (French, German, Spanish subtitles)

Dvd 5
Trying to kiss the moon, color, 1994, 96’, 16mm, super8mm,
video, original English version
(French, German, Spanish subtitles)
Lost dreams, N&B, 2003, 20’, video

The quality is as good as or maybe slightly better than the Re:Voir release.

You can view a PDF review of the set here.
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foggy eyes
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#573 Post by foggy eyes »

Great, thanks.
Adrian Martin wrote:One film included in this set was nothing short of a revelation for me. Behindert (1974) is an astonishingly intimate recreation of Dwoskin’s time with actor Carola Regnier (who gives a hypnotically intricate performance of her own desires and vulnerabilities). This is Dwoskin’s masterpiece. Indeed, I have come to regard it as the one of the greatest works in cinema history.
Now I have to buy this. Time to start saving!
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domino harvey
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#574 Post by domino harvey »

I've always respected Martin's more level-handed film discussions, so such hyperbole is both doubly surprising and admittedly very persuasive
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foggy eyes
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Re: BFI (British Film Institute)

#575 Post by foggy eyes »

domino harvey wrote:I've always respected Martin's more level-handed film discussions, so such hyperbole is both doubly surprising and admittedly very persuasive
He's at it again:
You know the cinephile game that consists of proclaiming, ridiculously but passionately: ‘cinema is Rio Bravo, is Le Mépris, is Viaggio in Italia, is Gertrud, is Eyes Wide Shut’ ... ? Well, now I too can play the game, because cinema for me is, categorically, Jerzy Skolimowski’s Le Départ (1967). How can this amazing film have counted for so little in the annals of post-Nouvelle Vague film history, when it should figure as one of the great culminations of ‘60s cinema? (It does happen to be Louis Garrel’s favourite film, as I learnt from some stray fashion magazine.) It is cinema in so many ways: as a city film (about Brussels, hypnotic in all its aspects); as the portrait of an iconic young star (Jean-Pierre Léaud) at the paroxysmic height of his histrionic, acting-out energy (and Skolimowski misses no opportunity for a lark, a disguise or a prank); as surely among the very finest fusions of image and incident with an almost non-stop jazz score by the legendary Krzysztof Komeda (1931-1969) – whole, complex passages (bridging many scene and location changes) seem shaped around the dynamics of the large ‘cues’ in this score; and as freewheeling, masquerade comedy (Léaud dubbing himself – the whole film, I think, is post-sync, ‘sounds like a porno’ as critic Antonio Weinrichter observed – in mock-Indian is a highlight). The print was old and falling apart, but it didn’t matter. On screen it was great; nonetheless, it is The DVD We Need.
More here.

The film sounds incredible - "persuasive" doesn't even begin to cover it!
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