Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

Discuss internationally-released DVDs and Blu-rays or other international DVD and Blu-ray-related topics.
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Pavel
Joined: Fri Aug 07, 2020 2:41 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#501 Post by Pavel » Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:50 am

I don't remember The Image Book well (I despised it), but I'm pretty sure it was intentional.

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hearthesilence
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:22 am
Location: NYC

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#502 Post by hearthesilence » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:26 pm

barbarella satyricon wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:38 am
Does anyone know of any confirmed issues with the English subtitles on Kino Lorber’s The Image Book blu ray? From the disc that I had, it seemed like about 40-50% of the subs were missing, like every other line in some sequences, but entirely absent in others. My French isn’t good at all, but even from the opening, with Godard’s voice-over narration, it was apparent that about every other line of translation was being dropped.

On the other hand, there were some sequences that looked to be subtitled in full, and others that had no subs at all. I thought at first that some of the clips in other languages (i.e. not French) were intentionally left unsubbed, but that didn’t seem consistent across scenes either. I messaged Kino Lorber through their customer service form, but didn’t hear back, and just got a refund on the disc before the return window on the purchase (from another online vendor) had closed. Not sure if I just got a bad disc, but am certain that there were major problems with the subs and that it definitely wasn’t some intentional Navajo thing.
This is actually not an error - check out the film's own thread, you'll find a discussion about this as it was screened this way during its theatrical release. An excerpt:
Noiretirc wrote:
Sun Jan 27, 2019 6:07 pm
hearthesilence, may I ask you if the sporadic/arbitrary subtitling bothered/baffled you? (I have not had an opportunity to see this yet.)
hearthesilence wrote:
Sun Jan 27, 2019 7:39 pm
No but I know some French and was able to fill in some gaps. The subtitling really is sparse but it’s possible they tell enough. Honestly it felt like film literacy was far more important - it helps to know the films he’s referencing ahead of time.

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barbarella satyricon
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:45 am

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#503 Post by barbarella satyricon » Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:52 pm

Thanks for that. That is an eye-opener, wow. And just now I found this post on r/criterion asking the same question and receiving basically the same response. Was this ever outlined in press releases or in the specs for home video releases? It seems bizarre to me, as the Film Socialisme blu at least had the complete subs to supplement the “Navajo” ones. Thanks for filling me in though.

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barbarella satyricon
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:45 am

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#504 Post by barbarella satyricon » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:16 pm

hearthesilence wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 1:26 pm
This is actually not an error - check out the film's own thread, you'll find a discussion about this as it was screened this way during its theatrical release.
Went through the thread for the film and don’t know how I missed the stuff about the sporadic subtitles when I had looked it up before. I guess I’ll still have to click some links and read up to see if the choice for the, uh, quirky subs are explained or outlined anywhere. So, good on Kino Lorber, I guess, for sticking with the filmmaker’s intent? I‘m the philistine who asked for his money back and got it.

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#505 Post by EddieLarkin » Wed Dec 30, 2020 2:21 pm

I happened to watch For Ever Mozart last night and even there a number of French lines and passages went unsubtitled, and James Quandt even calls attention to this fact in the commentary, so presumably Godard has been doing this for a long time now.

On the subject of The Image Book, Mubi quietly snuck it out on UK BD last month, but annoyingly I can't find a single review or even basic specs for it. Does anyone know of any reason the Kino would be preferable over it? I was just about to buy the latter but being in the UK the Mubi disc is a bit cheaper.

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diamonds
Joined: Sun Apr 24, 2016 2:35 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#506 Post by diamonds » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:40 pm

Earlier this year there was a great interview published with subtitler Andrew Litvack about working with a few French directors to subtitle their films, including Claire Denis, Olivier Assayas, and Godard. The Godard anecdote is pretty amusing, and Litvack does say that Godard "always wanted to subtitle as little as possible."

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barbarella satyricon
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 7:45 am

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#507 Post by barbarella satyricon » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:50 pm

diamonds wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:40 pm
Earlier this year there was a great interview published with subtitler Andrew Litvack about working with a few French directors to subtitle their films, including Claire Denis, Olivier Assayas, and Godard. The Godard anecdote is pretty amusing, and Litvack does say that Godard "always wanted to subtitle as little as possible."
I skipped to the Godard anecdote and skimmed the rest, but it’s already a great read. Thanks!

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domino harvey
Dot Com Dom
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#508 Post by domino harvey » Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:56 pm

It's a well known idiosyncrasy of subtitling Godard films that usually non-French speakers actually end up understanding way more than native speakers because subtitlers will translate inaudible or intentionally obfuscated dialogue that otherwise would be unheard/unclear

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hearthesilence
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 4:22 am
Location: NYC

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#509 Post by hearthesilence » Wed Dec 30, 2020 5:31 pm

diamonds wrote:
Wed Dec 30, 2020 3:40 pm
Earlier this year there was a great interview published with subtitler Andrew Litvack about working with a few French directors to subtitle their films, including Claire Denis, Olivier Assayas, and Godard. The Godard anecdote is pretty amusing, and Litvack does say that Godard "always wanted to subtitle as little as possible."
That interview is essential reading for anyone who's green about subtitling - it covers all the basics.

FWIW, Litvack was one of the main figures (really the main figure) interviewed back in 2014 for this NY Times story on subtitling.

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therewillbeblus
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 3:40 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#510 Post by therewillbeblus » Mon Jun 07, 2021 11:22 pm

I know this has been discussed, but I'm struggling to find a concrete answer nonetheless- what is the optimal blu-ray to buy for One Plus One, the abkco U.S. or the French?

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EddieLarkin
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2012 10:25 am

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#511 Post by EddieLarkin » Tue Jun 08, 2021 6:33 am

The abkco has a much improved transfer over other editions, and is in 1.66:1, which is surely the proper ratio considering much of the film is hardmatted to that ratio (the French is 1.37:1 but then switches to a boxed 1.66:1, showing the mattes top and bottom).

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domino harvey
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Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 2:42 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#512 Post by domino harvey » Tue Jun 08, 2021 6:37 am

The abkco is great and has a lovely commentary. I was a hardliner on the 1.33 before seeing its 1.66 transfer and I concur that it looks to be the OAR based on the hard matting of the intertitles

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therewillbeblus
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 3:40 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#513 Post by therewillbeblus » Tue Jun 08, 2021 10:57 am

Thanks guys!

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therewillbeblus
Joined: Tue Dec 22, 2015 3:40 pm

Re: Godard on DVD and Blu-ray

#514 Post by therewillbeblus » Thu Jun 10, 2021 5:48 pm

For some reason, the abkco blu shows up on my player as a BD-R but appears pressed. Anyways, Sterritt's commentary is terrific and expresses a lot of complex ideas in a very digestible manner- one of the best Godard commentaries I've heard. As an aside, I want to hear more about why Sterritt thinks Weekend is Godard's take on "film noir" (unless this is limited to the nefarious plot by the central couple in the fringes)

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