Auteur List: Billy Wilder - Discussion and Defenses

[domino harvey]

THE AUTEUR LIST: BILLY WILDER
April 22 - May 31

ELIGIBILITY SPECIFICS, EXCEPTIONS, AND SPECIAL CASES
Any film with Billy Wilder credited as director is eligible. Additionally, films wherein Wilder is credited with writing or co-writing the screenplay without directing are eligible, with the exception of remakes of earlier Wilder films (ie you can't vote for the Harrison Ford Sabrina or You're Never Too Young). Remakes by Wilder of other directors' works, such as Buddy Buddy, are of course eligible.

HOW TO SUBMIT YOUR LIST
Lists should be PMed to me, domino harvey, by May 31st

If you can read this, you are eligible to submit a list. If you are a lurker and want to participate, you should be able to PM me even if you cannot PM other members, as I am a moderator. If you are not able to PM me, please PM cdnchris, the forum's admin, who will either unlock your posting privileges or forward your list on to me

The minimum, maximum, and standard number of submitted films for each participating member is 10, in ranked order (With number one being the best and so on down the line). The final list will comprise of a Top 20, with supplemental recordings of also-rans and orphans, as in other list projects.

[DarkImbecile]

"An audience is never wrong. An individual member of it may be an imbecile, but a thousand imbeciles together in the dark — that is critical genius." ~ Billy WIlder

Billy Wilder was the first director I fell in love with when I first began taking film seriously, and the first in whose work I caught the recurring themes, interests, and perspectives of an auteur. He doesn't quite hold the same pride of place among my personal greats all these years later, but I still unabashadly adore Ace in the Hole, The Apartment, and Double Indemnity (yes, even Fred MacMurray), so I'm excited to see how these hold up decades after I first became enamored with them, and to fill in my few remaining blind spots for his career.

[movielocke]

Let’s cross our fingers for a May billy wilder bundle on the channel !

[Never Cursed]

On that note, Love In the Afternoon, Sunset Blvd, Some Like It Hot, People On Sunday, and Ball Of Fire are already there!

[knives]

I'm probably not going to participate too heavily, but likely only one film directed by him would make my list and my number one is a Lubitsch masterwork. Also, is A Song is Born eligible?

[Mr Sausage]

I’ve only seen 3 Wilders, Double Indemnity, Ace in the Hole, and Sunset Boulevard, but was greatly impressed with all three. That said, I’ve always felt I ought to watch more, but without feeling any motivation to do so.

[knives]

I'm sure I'll bear no controversy by saying that checking out The Apartment at least is a good idea. I'll also say Sabrina would be a good place to continue as well.

[domino harvey]

I'm probably not going to participate too heavily, but likely only one film directed by him would make my list and my number one is a Lubitsch masterwork. Also, is A Song is Born eligible?

It’s a remake and he’s credited because he co-wrote the story it’s based on (And I don’t believe there even is a screenplay credit for the actual author), so no barring new evidence

[knives]

Alright. Guess that makes two on the list.

[senseabove]

That sound you just heard was Midnight rocketing by most of my rough draft list like the Road Runner as I read that scripts co-/written by Wilder are eligible...

On that note, Love In the Afternoon, Sunset Blvd, Some Like It Hot, People On Sunday, and Ball Of Fire are already there!

For prioritization purposes, note that Love in the Afternoon leaves at the end of this month.

[Rayon Vert]

The only movies in his filmography I haven't seen are his 1934 French film Mauvaise Graine, The Emperor Waltz, and the last three (The Front Page, Fedora, Buddy Buddy) - none of which I'm planning to watch! - but I'll definitely minimally participate by rewatching the ones I was planning to anyways for the 50s project, and maybe a few others to finesse the ranking (The Apartment definitely) - and hopefully participate a bit in the discussions. And provide a list of course.

[domino harvey]

Just remembered I already ranked every Wilder-directed film in his filmmaker thread, but I didn't factor in his screenplay-only films (of which surely Bluebeard's Eighth Wife, Ball of Fire, and Hold Back the Dawn will factor in), so it won't quite reflect my final top ten

The only movies in his filmography I haven't seen are [...] The Emperor Waltz

I'll give this one a mild recommendation for Joan Fontaine's hairdo

[knives]

No Ninotchka?!

[swo17]

Proper ranking:

01 One,
02 Two,
03 Three

[domino harvey]

No Ninotchka?!

It's possible as well-- it has my second favorite Lubitsch ending behind To Be or Not to Be. And Midnight is okay but not a list worthy title for me (sorry senseabove)

[domino harvey]

Proper ranking:

01 One,
02 Two,
03 Three

"What is the ranked order of number of times I'd rather have a dog bite off my face than sit through One, Two, Three again?"

[Rayon Vert]

Yeah he's made god-awful ones, namely that horror, and many that are a very mixed bag.

Good thing there's the screenplay-only films too, because looking at his films I have a hard time finding 10 I really like! It stops at around 7.

[senseabove]

Love in the Afternoon Pleasant, occasionally bemusing, but never all that funny or surprising. If it has set-ups that almost have that signature Wilderian snap—the Coop's Last Tape scene, the file-pulling revelation—the whole thing is slowed to such gentility that all the momentum is sapped out. It's like Wilder was worried someone might get car sick, so he eeeeeeases into and out of everything. If you took those turns at speed, they'd probably merit a thrilled giggle, but at this pace, all they merit is a cognizant smirk. Nothing is helped by Cooper seeming hardly aware of the lines he's delivering in all but a handful of scenes, or by Hepburn never really bringing (or being allowed to bring) the cynicism of her character's tactic to the surface.

Hold Back the Dawn In a way, watching this before LitA did both movies a favor by underlining how both plots are, basically, that Wilder's black-hearted cynicism and willful naiveté are mutually contagious: "nobody's perfect" as indictment or as platitude. Where LitA flops due to its plodding performances, though, Dawn soars with Boyer's and de Havilland's superb leads. These two characters may be the most successfully idealized representations of those Wilderian poles. They're caricatures of each extreme fully rounded out by their complete circuit, and Boyer's steady speed around that bend is in beautiful contrast to de Havilland's sudden shifts. Her putting on glasses is as succinctly perfect as anything else in Wilder's career. I might very well have to rewatch this one in the next month...

[TMDaines]

Didn't realise films written by him were also going to eligible. I've seen 10 directed and a further 4 only written. I am looking at watching another 10 or so directed that I currently own. Baby due today though so film watching may fall off a cliff!

[TMDaines]

Love in the Afternoon Pleasant, occasionally bemusing, but never all that funny or surprising. If it has set-ups that almost have that signature Wilderian snap—the Coop's Last Tape scene, the file-pulling revelation—the whole thing is slowed to such gentility that all the momentum is sapped out. It's like Wilder was worried someone might get car sick, so he eeeeeeases into and out of everything. If you took those turns at speed, they'd probably merit a thrilled giggle, but at this pace, all they merit is a cognizant smirk. Nothing is helped by Cooper seeming hardly aware of the lines he's delivering in all but a handful of scenes, or by Hepburn never really bringing (or being allowed to bring) the cynicism of her character's tactic to the surface.

Watched this two days ago. Cooper is horrendously miscast from the perspective of 2020. He's only 55 or 56, but looks over 70. Hepburn was 27 or 28 but made to look a lot younger. The whole casting undermines the film.

[Rayon Vert]

Same negative feelings about Love in the Afternoon. It feels like Wilder is attempting a Lubitsch homage here, but yeah Cooper is simply awful in most scenes, especially at the beginning of the film (he’s nearly slurring his words at some point), even if one gets past the creepy age difference. There are a few amusing gags but the story is weak, the characters not endearing and the whole thing rather flat throughout.

[Shrew]

Yeah, I also caught Love in the Afternoon last week on the Criterion Channel. Seneseabove's "occasionally bemusing" is about where I'd put it. It's like a steamroller ran over a Lubitsch film--you can recognize the beats and the "touches" in the homage, but everything is flat and stretched out. Or repeated--the gag with the kissing couple getting splashed by the street cleaner isn't that funny the first time, and it's even less so the second time. Likewise, the "gypsies" leaving a room when it's time for lovemaking is a decent imitation Lubitsch touch, but Wilder just keeps going back to those doors and music (and in a Lubitsch film, at least one of those musicians would have been an actual character). I did enjoy Hepburn and Chevalier's dynamic though, and the scene where Cooper keeps looping through Hepburn's dalliances (and having the band go back to 1, and the bar cart rolling back and forth) sounds like a proto 90s electronica track.

Anyway, I was looking forward to participating in this, even though I'm not that big of a Wilder fan. I've seen most everything pre-Apartment but almost nothing post-Apartment. Unfortunately, my main access point for Wilder films--the library--isn't really an option any more, so now I'm going to have to determine how much I really want to want to blind buy any late Wilder. At least a few seem to be available for online rental.

[Rayon Vert]

Post-Apartment WIlder really isn't that great, although not terrible either - but it's hard to find any that equal his 40s and 50s work. My top three from this era are (but again I haven't seen the last three):

1. Irma La Douce
2. Avanti!
3. The Fortune Cookie (with Kiss Me Stupid not far behind)

For comparison's sake, I gave Love in the Afternoon, probably the worst pre-Apartment film, a C grade. Irma and Avanti! I gave B- grades, and a C+ for Fortune Cookie and Kiss Me Stupid.

Some people think the Sherlock Holmes film is some kind of late masterpiece, to me it was his worst after One Two Three. (D- and F respectively).

[Shrew]

Sherlock Holmes is actually the only late film I've seen, though I remember very little of it. Avanti! at least is available on Amazon Prime. Here's hoping Criterion Channel puts up a May lineup before I have to consider putting money on One Two Three.

I'm definitely going to be including some of Wilder's written credits, probably even People on Sunday. Can anyone recommend any of his other credits pre-Bluebeard's Eighth Wife? I know Emil und die Deketive has some supporters (I recall Kracauer treats it like divine revelation in From Caligari to Hitler), though I haven't seen it.

[Rayon Vert]

Irma la Douce can be bought or rented on Youtube.

A free, lowish but acceptable quality upload of Kiss Me Stupid (download it now for sakefeeping if you wish) in case it can't be found anywhere else.

MOD EDIT: Please do not post links to illegal uploads on YouTube