UHD New Releases, Reissues and Upgrades

[Finch]

samlop10 on BR said the Second Sight and Lionsgate 4Ks of You're Next are tied for video but he really appreciated the new Dolby Atmos track on the Lionsgate so I've marked the Lionsgate as a superior import, and put both discs in solid upgrades over the BDs.

[Finch]

Summer Wars (Shout Factory) review

[professorwho]

I was gonna link to my own review but wasn't fast enough, lmao

While in terms of detail, the new SDR BD matches it (and is competently encoded to boot), like Hosoda's latest film Belle, the CG scenes in the internet world are so visually complex and bitrate intensive that UHD is the only way to see them in their full glory despite being a 720p movie. As a result, either blue or red is appropriate, I feel.

[rrenault]

Just out of curiosity, is 8 1/2 considered a red column disc compared to both the Essential Fellini disc and the original circa 2010 standalone release or only to the latter?

[GoodOldNeon]

I think The Third Man (SC) should be upgraded to the red tier. While the visual upgrade seems to be marginal, the fact that it provides a superior audio track and fixes the numerous audio errors that plagued previous releases (missing dialogue, looped dialogue, synchronization problems; the full list and confirmation that they have been fixed is provided by nicolas here: https://forum.blu-ray.com/showpost.php? ... tcount=226) makes this a reference title.

[nicolas]

I was gonna link to my own review but wasn't fast enough, lmao

While in terms of detail, the new SDR BD matches it (and is competently encoded to boot), like Hosoda's latest film Belle, the CG scenes in the internet world are so visually complex and bitrate intensive that UHD is the only way to see them in their full glory despite being a 720p movie. As a result, either blue or red is appropriate, I feel.

Hey prof, nice to have you here.

[tenia]

In this article for Filmmaker Magazine about UHDs, we learn that Kino's UHDs are encoded by Compound Production.

[nicolas]

In this article for Filmmaker Magazine about UHDs, we learn that Kino's UHDs are encoded by Compound Production.

Interesting read, thanks for posting! Sweeney’s descriptions of how hard, expensive etc. the 4K process is may be true but then again it’s ridiculous that they’re not trying to make the best out of their situation with each new title and deliver the best-possible product for their investments. It also says a lot that they’d rather have the guy who did their BD encodes to purchase himself a costly new setup and throw him in the deep end rather than hiring a party that is already well-equipped and established in the 4K market to ensure better quality. I feel like between the lines he suggests us to shut up and be grateful about what they’re doing - of course a lot more polite and indirect than their forum mouthpiece.

[Drucker]

To fully editorialize, and just to think out loud...it's been helpful to realize that these companies are companies in search of profit, first, before anything else. Kino's strategy of putting out a ton of releases before other companies do is their market! Would they have been able to put out all of those MGM 4Ks into the market first if they had to search for a new authoring house? What kind of costs would they incur to do so? The cost of hiring new employees is not nil, and there is a risk involved. Kino is a different company than Criterion and Arrow, with different goals and probably different financials. Kino are "first movers." And of course, Criterion, separately can count on people buying their releases regardless of what is already in the market, given their brand. They have no need to be first movers because we know if a Criterion edition comes out years after another, it will still sell enough copies to justify its existence (All About Eve, Strangelove).

I think the amount of people that care about encodes is a small subset of the small subset of people that buy these releases in the first place. I wish Kino had a better product, but clearly they don't need my dollars.

[tenia]

I think the amount of people that care about encodes is a small subset of the small subset of people that buy these releases in the first place. I wish Kino had a better product, but clearly they don't need my dollars.

Exactly.
On the other hand, they're dead wrong if Kino believe the overall US market is composed at 40% of UHD sales. It's not, and instead is probably composed of 10% max of UHD sales (in volume), 30% BD and 60% DVD. MPN stats are not accounting for the whole market, but only the best sellers, and those, well, are getting BD and UHD releases to begin with, and the best sellers are usually big studio movies that are skewed in favor of the higher formats. They also tend to include 4k re-releases which of course are going to be composed at 99% of UHD sales since that's the sole format making the news.
It does not mean this bias isn't true for some titles, some labels (I mean, some don't do DVD anymore so it won't be a 3-way split to begin with) or some genres, but these stats absolutely aren't representative of the home video market, only a small portion of it.

[nicolas]

I think the amount of people that care about encodes is a small subset of the small subset of people that buy these releases in the first place. I wish Kino had a better product, but clearly they don't need my dollars.

Agree with all you said. KL themselves have proven that by subsequently lowering their standards without any resistance by their core buyer group as their encodes are even worse now than when their BD encoder started doing the 4K discs. Technically you’d think that the 4K format and physical media these days largely appeals to a more dedicated user base, so better encodes should be in the interest of those but as you correctly said that’s not the reality (for KL).

It’s just sad that even Criterion who could afford to be just like them decided to do a little better and tweak some encoder settings for the better. There’s no reason the KL guy couldn’t do the same as the rendering would surely take just as long, cost as much,… as their present set-and-forget stuff. Heck, they could even save money as so many of their films would easily fit on BD-66 discs but then they’d probably get comments like “But why isn’t it a BD-100? Why are the bitrates not over 100MBs?” Surely for that reason, Vinegar Syndrome added Dolby Vision and a “High Bitrate UHD100” blurb to some of their 4Ks starting with The Tenant.

[therewillbeblus]

I've read through Geoff's reviews, but wondering if anyone here can vouch for Kill Bill being a substantial enough upgrade over the BD to warrant a $50+ purchase? It's one of my favorite films, so I feel obligated to see it in its best form, though not if I'm not gonna notice a difference!

I got them after reading the many negative comments and am happy for one key reason: Detail recovery across both films. I’ve rarely seen such ugly, blown-out masters like these two films on the old BDs. Some people speculated that this was intended by Robert Richardson but that’s BS when looking at his other films that got restored and how much detail they captured even for these ancient DIs. The new HDR grades are also more subdued and ultimately film-like, which is what I was looking for and received from the 4Ks. There’s other stuff like select scenes / shots having been further degrained (or rather denoised) but I personally consider this minor against the clear advantages I mentioned. I also love both both films, caved in and bought the two for around $60 in total as that’s going to be it for a long time after Tarantino clearly made the decision to not invest into a rebuild. It’s his call as he got the rights to the films before he licensed them to Lionsgate.

Yeah the old BDs aren't great. If these are noticeably better, I'll just spring for it - thanks nicolas!

So my copy of Kill Bill vol. 2 skips/freezes from 44:00 to about 54:00 .... has anyone else had an issue with this? Another case where the disc is spotless, did the tests/cleaning, same problem persists. Wondering how Lionsgate usually responds to requests for replacements? They really make it tough to find the right contact etc.

[nicolas]

So my copy of Kill Bill vol. 2 skips/freezes from 44:00 to about 54:00 .... has anyone else had an issue with this? Another case where the disc is spotless, did the tests/cleaning, same problem persists. Wondering how Lionsgate usually responds to requests for replacements? They really make it tough to find the right contact etc.

Checked mine and all is well over here. Have you checked the playback surface with a flashlight? It’s usually a very small, deep, circular scratch that ruins the disc rather than the ones in random directions we’re usually getting from Mexico. These small scratches are usually not palpable if you look at discs with regular light. FWIW, I’ll check all my discs like that and am able to identify faulty ones rather quickly that way.

[Finch]

First positive review of Lionsgate's Basic Instinct 4K here

[nicolas]

Sunset Boulevard 75th Anniversary Paramount Presents 4K coming later this year. I was hoping they licensed it to Arrow or Criterion.

[Finch]

I'm going to highly recommend 88's Miracle 4K. I'd not seen the film before and thanks to Eddie Ma's spectacular sets and lighting, it's a feast for your eyes. Easily Jackie's most beautiful looking film. Especially in the early section with the montage of Anita Mui drawing the crowds to the Ritz, I thought there were images you could print out and frame on your wall. A splendid presentation that absolutely helped make Miracle one of my three to five favorite Chan movies on first watch.

I also really enjoyed the Short Night of the Glass Dolls 4K. I only have 88's older Blu-ray to go on and couldn't tell you if 88's somewhat brighter restoration is more faithful to the film's theatrical appearance or Celluloid Dreams's which I've not seen in motion. The older 88 BD looks fine but fairly flat compared to the 4K's dazzling colors.

I'll be nominating both 4Ks for the Best of 2025 thread.

[nicolas]

I'm going to highly recommend 88's Miracle 4K. I'd not seen the film before and thanks to Eddie Ma's spectacular sets and lighting, it's a feast for your eyes. Easily Jackie's most beautiful looking film. Especially in the early section with the montage of Anita Mui drawing the crowds to the Ritz, I thought there were images you could print out and frame on your wall. A splendid presentation that absolutely helped make Miracle one of my three to five favorite Chan movies on first watch.

I also really enjoyed the Short Night of the Glass Dolls 4K. I only have 88's older Blu-ray to go on and couldn't tell you if 88's somewhat brighter restoration is more faithful to the film's theatrical appearance or Celluloid Dreams's which I've not seen in motion. The older 88 BD looks fine but fairly flat compared to the 4K's dazzling colors.

I'll be nominating both 4Ks for the Best of 2025 thread.

Thanks for the recommendations and your write up, Finch. Great to hear that you enjoyed both 4Ks. I’ve ordered Miracle in 88’s shop and will receive it when Night Train Murderers releases. Looking very much forward to it.

Here is an in-depth post from Celluloid Dreams about their process for Short Night of Glass Dolls and specifically their reference material for the colors. This post shows one screenshot example of the grading difference.

Also noticed yesterday that there are caps available of the German 4Ks of Armour of God 1 and 2. For anyone considering these, avoid as both are upscales of older masters. I’m sure 88 will get around to do part 1 in due course soon after part 2.

[Finch]

Re Short Night, there were several shots in the 88 4K that were very dark, notably nighttime shots of Gregory's apartment interiors. As I was watching the film, I didn't feel that the brightness levels were too high for the daytime scenes. I'm sure the CD release is excellent in its own right but I won't be purchasing a second copy of this film.

[Jean-Luc Garbo]

That's good to hear about Miracle. It's one of his films I haven't seen so I wasn't sure what to expect from that 4k - I'll try to get that one this year. Ditto on Short Night. I was leaning to the 88 release but both those posts from CD are quite helpful.

[Finch]

Gandhi steelbook impressions from fkid: better encode and Dolby Vision, film spread across 2 BD-100s.

[therewillbeblus]

So my copy of Kill Bill vol. 2 skips/freezes from 44:00 to about 54:00 .... has anyone else had an issue with this? Another case where the disc is spotless, did the tests/cleaning, same problem persists. Wondering how Lionsgate usually responds to requests for replacements? They really make it tough to find the right contact etc.

Checked mine and all is well over here. Have you checked the playback surface with a flashlight? It’s usually a very small, deep, circular scratch that ruins the disc rather than the ones in random directions we’re usually getting from Mexico. These small scratches are usually not palpable if you look at discs with regular light. FWIW, I’ll check all my discs like that and am able to identify faulty ones rather quickly that way.

Replacement disc skips in the same spot as well. Is there any reported/known issues with this disc playing on Panasonic 820 players? Beyond frustrated with this format

[nicolas]

So my copy of Kill Bill vol. 2 skips/freezes from 44:00 to about 54:00 .... has anyone else had an issue with this? Another case where the disc is spotless, did the tests/cleaning, same problem persists. Wondering how Lionsgate usually responds to requests for replacements? They really make it tough to find the right contact etc.

Checked mine and all is well over here. Have you checked the playback surface with a flashlight? It’s usually a very small, deep, circular scratch that ruins the disc rather than the ones in random directions we’re usually getting from Mexico. These small scratches are usually not palpable if you look at discs with regular light. FWIW, I’ll check all my discs like that and am able to identify faulty ones rather quickly that way.

Replacement disc skips in the same spot as well. Is there any reported/known issues with this disc playing on Panasonic 820 players? Beyond frustrated with this format

I’ve checked the BR thread and searched for “skipping” and nothing came up but I asked if anyone else has the same issues. I’ve put in your time stamps and noted that you also had issues with Winchester. I’ll report back if I get an answer.

https://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.ph ... 31&page=13

[therewillbeblus]

Thanks nicolas!

[nicolas]

Thanks nicolas!

First answer just came in: “Sounds like the blu ray disc lens need a clean”

[Finch]

Jean de Florette/Manon of the Spring (Criterion) Chris's review